So I know we're not supposed to talk politics - Presidential Election - Poll

We could go around all day on this. There is a medium that we are

blatantly missing.

Nobody generating wealth for me based on my property taxes.

 

Anyone generating wealth for a company should be paid accordingly and if he isn't he is free to go elsewhere however you seem to feel like the wealth should be spread across all the workers, that's not how the world works. The owner may have been eating cheese sandwiches for 20 years before making it, jealous workers never seem to consider what it took the owner to get where he is.

Anyone generating wealth for a company should be paid accordingly and if he isn't he is free to go elsewhere however you seem to feel like the wealth should be spread across all the workers, that's not how the world works. The owner may have been eating cheese sandwiches for 20 years before making it, jealous workers never seem to consider what it took the owner to get where he is.

 

 

No no.. lol.. no. I never said evenly. I never even said "fair".

 

 

I'm merely talking wages keeping up with inflation. Nothing more. That is not unreasonable. What we have now is owners wages destroying the inflation rate since the 90's... this is why we're having the discussion we're having. All goes back to someone's lunch getting stolen...

 

 

No no.. lol.. no. I never said evenly. I never even said "fair".

 

 

I'm merely talking wages keeping up with inflation. Nothing more. That is not unreasonable. What we have now is owners wages destroying the inflation rate since the 90's... this is why we're having the discussion we're having. All goes back to someone's lunch getting stolen...

 

Maybe the lower skilled drones that get 15 per hr to start are taking from the people you describe. Once upon a time entry level jobs were just that, now they are supposed to support a family. Can't have it both ways. I still say someone contributing to wealth building will get rewarded by owner or another company will take that person.

Maybe the lower skilled drones that get 15 per hr to start are taking from the people you describe. Once upon a time entry level jobs were just that, now they are supposed to support a family. Can't have it both ways. I still say someone contributing to wealth building will get rewarded by owner or another company will take that person.

 

 

Agree completely until the end of your statement. Come walk in my shoes for a mile or two.

 

Cheers.

BTW pay is regulated by the market, supply and demand.

 

 

Right, so by virtue of that, wages will continue to fall as there is always someone more desperate, willing to work for less. This is precisely why wages haven't kept up with inflation. We have unchecked, unbalanced capitalism... it needs to be constrained... it will shake itself apart in our lifetime if something doesn't change. I'm not suggesting I should be a top earner in the country. I'm merely suggesting that per inflation, I am about 46% underpaid if I wanted a lifestyle like my mother provided as a laborer. Quite frankly, I went to school so that I could do better for my kids. Sadly, I'd be content with par at this point.

 

 

 

Agree completely until the end of your statement. Come walk in my shoes for a mile or two.

 

Cheers.

 

A number of us on this board, and most of the people who pay a majority of the taxes in this country have walked in your shoes for much more than a mile or two.

 

The difference is most of us decided to go out and get a new pair of shoes.

 

Your old shoes must be very comfortable since you seem uninterested in going out and doing anything to change that situation.

 

I guess when you only work from 9 o'clock to 3 o'clock, your shoes never get worn out anyway.

No no.. lol.. no. I never said evenly. I never even said "fair".

 

 

I'm merely talking wages keeping up with inflation. Nothing more. That is not unreasonable. What we have now is owners wages destroying the inflation rate since the 90's... this is why we're having the discussion we're having. All goes back to someone's lunch getting stolen...

 

kmb58, do yourself a favor and watch the video below.

It is old, however still relevant today.

 

A number of us on this board, and most of the people who pay a majority of the taxes in this country have walked in your shoes for much more than a mile or two.

 

The difference is most of us decided to go out and get a new pair of shoes.

 

Your old shoes must be very comfortable since you seem uninterested in going out and doing anything to change that situation.

 

I guess when you only work from 9 o'clock to 3 o'clock, your shoes never get worn out anyway.

 

 

That's a bit of an assumption.. I have some seeds of thought that I am watering.. and that is actually thanks to some of you.

 

Actually, while saying that, I must admit that chatting with you all has changed my POV a bit. It has made it apparent that the path to more is certainly there. However, it doesn't change the fact that wages should have increased a bit more and that my comfortable shoes shouldn't be a bit more comfortable..

kmb58, do yourself a favor and watch the video below.

It is old, however still relevant today.

 

 

 

Yes, while that may be true and actually why I am where I am now, opposed to where I was a few years ago, it still doesn't account for the difference in the cost of bread over the last 20 years.

 

And... it also doesn't reflect well on a person to jump jobs several times. This points back to my initial point about risking life in minutes and seconds..

 

 

Good vid though.. cheers.

If there will be tax increases for your evil bosses are you willing to take a pay cut?

 

Oh you don't have to answer that either LOL

 

 

 

Aaaaaand.... lmfao.. let's back the f$$& up here and point out that you're blatantly admitting that TRICKLE DOWN ECONOMICS DOES NOT WORK 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

 

 

Thanks for that one.. I'll put that right in my pocket...

Aaaaaand.... lmfao.. let's back the f$$& up here and point out that you're blatantly admitting that TRICKLE DOWN ECONOMICS DOES NOT WORK 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

 

 

Thanks for that one.. I'll put that right in my pocket...

 

 

Last I checked, Venezuela wasn't doing as well as the US.

Last I checked, Venezuela wasn't doing as well as the US.

 

 

 

I know nothing about Venezuela. Tell me, do they have great schools? Do their people have the freedoms we have? What are their taxes like?

 

----

 

Edited to say: I'm sorry, did you just compare a blip on the map to the superpower of the world? I'm literally scratching my head. How can you compare the two? What is their primary export? Coffee?? Get that out of here...

 

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No.. no no. Never mind on all fronts.i don't care about Venezuela. We are America. We make things work. We achieve, we improve.. we LEAD!!! There is nothing any of you can say that will justify an argument the points I have made today.

 

I have not said anyone here needs to head to the poor house. I have asked no one to miss a meal, sell off a car. I'm just saying that wages should be within reason in comparison to inflation. It's NOT unreasonable.

 

If it is unreasonable = please explain why!

I know nothing about Venezuela. Tell me, do they have great schools? Do their people have the freedoms we have? What are their taxes like?

 

----

 

Edited to say: I'm sorry, did you just compare a blip on the map to the superpower of the world? I'm literally scratching my head. How can you compare the two? What is their primary export? Coffee?? Get that out of here...

 

-----

 

No.. no no. Never mind on all fronts.i don't care about Venezuela. We are America. We make things work. We achieve, we improve.. we LEAD!!! There is nothing any of you can say that will justify an argument the points I have made today.

 

I have not said anyone here needs to head to the poor house. I have asked no one to miss a meal, sell off a car. I'm just saying that wages should be within reason in comparison to inflation. It's NOT unreasonable.

 

If it is unreasonable = please explain why!

 

 

 

Guys.. I'm tapping out after the checkmate that was trickle down economics..

 

 

If you're a business owner= just have another look. Your people arey making you wealthy. They are doing it with a smile on their face and in return for making you wealthy, they are sacrificing their time here on earth. I'm not saying make them rich. Maybe they're not doing as well as you think.

 

 

Enjoy your Sunday-

 

 

KB

No no.. lol.. no. I never said evenly. I never even said "fair".

 

 

I'm merely talking wages keeping up with inflation. Nothing more. That is not unreasonable. What we have now is owners wages destroying the inflation rate since the 90's... this is why we're having the discussion we're having. All goes back to someone's lunch getting stolen...

 

You have such a thick skull .

 

Stealing your lunch was a metaphor, I was talking about competition, two individuals both equally as broke, one willing to work for free and starve some more until he reaches his goals and one stumping his feet whining and calling the world unfair.

 

There is always someone willing to work harder, faster, smarter and for less in order to cut your lunch when you are just an ungrateful whiner.

 

Anyway I am done with you, enjoy being miserable.

You have such a thick skull .

 

Stealing your lunch was a metaphor, I was talking about competition, two individuals both equally as broke, one willing to work for free and starve some more until he reaches his goals and one stumping his feet whining and calling the world unfair.

 

There is always someone willing to work harder, faster, smarter and for less in order to cut your lunch when you are just an ungrateful whiner.

 

Anyway I am done with you, enjoy being miserable.

 

 

Thick scull? Pot, meet kettle. I already said all of that.

 

Stealing my lunch is more appropriate when said about the lack of wage growth for workers vs. CEO/Owner/who ever; over the last twenty years.

 

I should be grateful for making someone else rich, while I struggle? FUUUCK u. (Not you personally)

 

Keep it coming, there is no argument you can make that I can't counter-- get this-- without insulting you.

Right, so by virtue of that, wages will continue to fall as there is always someone more desperate, willing to work for less. This is precisely why wages haven't kept up with inflation. We have unchecked, unbalanced capitalism... it needs to be constrained... it will shake itself apart in our lifetime if something doesn't change.

 

That's not how it works. Wages do not permanently keep falling. Yes, there is always someone willing to work for less, but you're forgetting that there is also always someone willing to pay more. Supply and demand naturally balance each other out. One reason for wage stagnation is due to the rising costs of healthcare. If you look at per capita incomes, they have continually increased over time:

 

LINK

 

Remember, incomes = wages + benefits. Because of the rising costs of healthcare, less and less of a person's income is being left for wages. Thus, even though incomes are increasing, you oftentimes have wages stalled or even decreasing in certain industries.

 

Not sure what you mean by "unchecked, unbalanced capitalism" that "needs to be constrained..." how? Like have the government mandate by law that everyone get paid more? I can guarantee you that won't work the way you think it will.

 

I'm not suggesting I should be a top earner in the country. I'm merely suggesting that per inflation, I am about 46% underpaid if I wanted a lifestyle like my mother provided as a laborer. Quite frankly, I went to school so that I could do better for my kids. Sadly, I'd be content with par at this point.

 

You say she made what you do now in terms of pure numbers of dollars with only a high school education. May I ask what he job was and how long she was working at it? Because if she was on the job twenty years, she might have been making more than you as a more beginner person in your profession.

 

Its unreasonable since most jobs in the US were outsourced, leaving service industry jobs. These are now being staffed by people illegally in the country. The legit businessman cannot stay competitive because if he pays his staff more his prices must reflect this and customers wont pay the premium. You increase minimum wage, business owner have to reduce hours and lay off staff. Money comes from somewhere. Will you pay $50 a cup of coffee so the barista can make 100k a year? Of course not... will you buy a toaster at wallmart made in China for $10 or the one made in USA for $100...... will you eat breakfast at the diner employing US teens for $50 or the one with illegal workers for $8? There are so many layers to this cake.

Yes, while that may be true and actually why I am where I am now, opposed to where I was a few years ago, it still doesn't account for the difference in the cost of bread over the last 20 years.

 

And... it also doesn't reflect well on a person to jump jobs several times. This points back to my initial point about risking life in minutes and seconds..

 

 

Good vid though.. cheers.

 

Bread costs more today than twenty years ago because of inflation. A low level of inflation is considered healthy.

 

Aaaaaand.... lmfao.. let's back the f$$& up here and point out that you're blatantly admitting that TRICKLE DOWN ECONOMICS DOES NOT WORK 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

 

 

Thanks for that one.. I'll put that right in my pocket...

 

A few things:

 

1) There has never been such a thing as "Trickle Down Economics." That is a canard that was created by the Democrats and political Left to distort what is appropriately called Supply-Side Economics. No economist, Left or Right, has ever supported some policy or theory of trickle-down economics.

 

2) Not sure how you claim Fortis's argument refutes anything. Saying that if the tax is raised on the business owner, that he may force the workers to take a pay cut, from what I can see would actually refute your own arguments.

 

I know nothing about Venezuela. Tell me, do they have great schools? Do their people have the freedoms we have? What are their taxes like?

 

----

 

Edited to say: I'm sorry, did you just compare a blip on the map to the superpower of the world? I'm literally scratching my head. How can you compare the two? What is their primary export? Coffee?? Get that out of here...

 

-----

 

No.. no no. Never mind on all fronts.i don't care about Venezuela. We are America. We make things work. We achieve, we improve.. we LEAD!!! There is nothing any of you can say that will justify an argument the points I have made today.

 

I have not said anyone here needs to head to the poor house. I have asked no one to miss a meal, sell off a car. I'm just saying that wages should be within reason in comparison to inflation. It's NOT unreasonable.

 

If it is unreasonable = please explain why!

 

Doc_K referenced Venezuela because they were doing fairly nicely until they elected Hugo Chavez back in 1998, who proceeded to then begin implementing hard socialism which has since then completely wrecked the country, turning it from a place where supermarkets were full of food to where now people are starving and rioting and it's a dictatorship.

 

As for why it is unreasonable, your position that wages should be within reason of inflation is not unreasonable unto itself, it's that your proposed method of how to achieve such (i.e. government command) is very unreasonable and won't work because it ignores WHY wages are not keeping up with inflation.

Wheels--- good response, working from phone here.. it's not that the wages fall, it's that they don't keep pace with inflation. I may respond with more. She did have about 25 years in at that point.

 

Szabo_Martin... nonono.. I'm not talking about burger flippers and baristas. I'm talking about real jobs, not even laborers.. who should be able to live.. I'm talking strictly about those with decent educations who should be doing better than a police officer... not that they shouldn't also do well.

Wheels, again, great points.. I'm not talking hard socialism and as to how this capitalism should be checked and balanced.. I don't have that answer. I'm merely pointing out the broken cog.

 

 

Self correction, self adjustment would be great. I'd happily carry on my life as an employee of someone else... I don't want to own the world. Just a nice driver 6.0, my current home and lifestyle are absolutely fine 😂

 

I do agree.. sadly rates are dropping across the board here too.. lots of outsourcing (engineers etc.) I don't know the answer. Like a domino effect.. wages drop, unemployment goes up, whos paying taxes to pay the cops and paramedics, teachers, seniors pensions??

I do agree.. sadly rates are dropping across the board here too.. lots of outsourcing (engineers etc.) I don't know the answer. Like a domino effect.. wages drop, unemployment goes up, whos paying taxes to pay the cops and paramedics, teachers, seniors pensions??

 

 

 

Right! See... I'm not the Official Cuck they claim I am. ✌️️

 

 

I don't have the answer. Hell, I know very little about economics- I create things. I don't need a Ph.D in economics to seeeeeee that stuff ain't right as it is.

I do agree.. sadly rates are dropping across the board here too.. lots of outsourcing (engineers etc.) I don't know the answer. Like a domino effect.. wages drop, unemployment goes up, whos paying taxes to pay the cops and paramedics, teachers, seniors pensions??

 

 

OMG!! You're from Canada!!!❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️ I absolutely love your country. I have many many friends in 🇨🇦... what a great place. If Toronto wasn't another country, we would live much closer..

Right! See... I'm not the Official Cuck they claim I am. ������✌️️

 

 

I don't have the answer. Hell, I know very little about economics- I create things. I don't need a Ph.D in economics to seeeeeee that stuff ain't right as it is.

 

If you know very little about economics, you are going to have a very misinformed worldview about things and you won't understand what politicians, Left or Right, are actually selling you. Here are some books to get started with to understand the more right-wing perspective on things:

 

Basic Economics

 

Capitalism and Freedom

 

Free to Choose

 

Now, I am not saying you will agree 100% with everything in these books, but they will open your eyes a lot more to why people on this forum think the way they do and maybe change your mind on a lot of things. They also provide a good foundation for other books.