The Modern Man Thread

Carrying over our discussion from another thread, the basic idea is dicssing the current state of what it means to be a man in the modern western world:

 

Not to derail the thread but most "men" these days (I'd say 80-90%) are highly feminized betas that let women run the show. Not saying women shouldn't work or vote, but I could go on for days about this topic (might make for a good thread?). There's a huge problem in the west is that men have stopped being traditionally masculine for fear of being "backwards" or "misogynistic" (which many feminist are...yes this word means anyone with an primarily negative view of the opposite gender male or female). Some of what we're seeing now is the the result of this coming to fruition.

I have to somewhat agree with this logic. We have a lack of males today, even in the U.S., (I'm starting to notice), that want to be strong, masculine, provide for their family, etc. I will forever believe that the WWII generation was the best generation. Take my grandfather for example. The man lived through The Dust Bowl. He was a Marine who fought in WWII in Japan, then fought in the Korean War. He then became a Sheriff in California for 40 years. He would ride horses and take care of a farm, getting up every morning at 5 A.M. to do manual labor. He was a butcher who started a business in a small farming town in California. He worked fcuking hard. There wasn't a day in his life that he never worked. The thing is, he isn't the only one like that. I knew many WWII veterans that were and still are like this. They knew what it meant to fight, to raise a family, to work, to provide, but most importantly, they knew what it was to be a man. These men knew failure wasn't an option. Even other elderly males who didn't serve during this time have a strong set of values. Today's generation of males have no idea how easy they have it. Most of them haven't had to go off to fight a war. Most of them have never been to another country that is crumbling due to causes like oppressive radical Islam, or evil Nazi's. Most males in America have never had to do manual labor like working on a farm and gathering or hunting for your family. The masculine male is a dying breed, I hate to say, and I'm seeing it wherever I go in the U.S.

Agree with Doc K -- we have enough men who could be more masculine in the USA, to put it nicely. Not every dude in the states is a SEAL, Army Ranger or played inside linebacker in high school, pardon the stereotypes.

 

I'd blame it on the sexual revolution of the late '60s. A respectable cause gone too far, and to neither sides benefit. For women's equality it's great but it sure hasn't made men the most attractive they could be, the gender whose attractiveness is highly reliant on things other than looks.

 

Television and film perpetuate it too on subliminal levels. The bumbling idiot husband....we've all seen it, perhaps laughed at it without realizing how big of a problem it is.

 

As far as European men being too metro, not so sure I've seen that. I thought the claim was that American women loved the "boldness" and "romantic charm" of Euro guys. Maybe it's just a change of scenery and personality, but I didn't get the vibe those guys were a bunch of betas. Not any worse than what we have here.

 

I don't know if there's confusion between social liberalism and toughness.

 

 

The happiest couples I've observed over the years are when the woman allows the husband to be masculine.

 

It's very subtle stuff. You don't need that super subservient Asian woman stereotype either...

 

Interactions with foreign women versus American women time and time again prove there's a difference in this one category. They give more feminine energy up front which automatically raises the man's masculine energy, and it multiplies a bit from there.

 

Now this isn't an anti-American woman rant by any means because guess what......they're complaining about us too in this very respect.

 

Gives the chosen ones an opportunity to stand out and dominate. Always gotta see it glass half full.

 

 

Might be time to combine forces...

 

 

 

I do agree that the sexual revolution of the 60's is where it all started...Women who had been repressed in our society wanted to break through and a lot of beta men went right along with it because they thought it would mean free sex for them. Little did they realize how far the pendulum would swing and would wind up in all of these passionless and sexless relationships.

 

There's nothing wrong with women's rights, but we've swung the pendulum too far so everything feminine is near-holy and not to be questioned, while all things masculine are sexist and to be mocked. Masculine and feminine are 2 halves of a very complementary system that's gotten use as a species where we are today. But in the modern era in the west we've seen the decline of the masculine which is creating a large void. That's why my favorite comic is Bill Burr, he's the only voice in the modern era with the balls to point this out. And before some white knight type leaps in here about male privilege I'll have you consider that if life as man is so exponentially great, why is the male suicide rate 4 times higher than that of females?

 

Before we fully thread jack here, I'll start a new thread in the off topic section. I look forward to some insightful discussion

 

This article popped up on Yahoo the other day about this very topic of feminized men. Although the title of the article is funny, this article which is written by a woman hits the nail on the head about how society has changed the standard of masculinity.

 

http://thefederalist.com/2016/07/20/when-t...-first-to-fall/

 

 

 

This article popped up on Yahoo the other day about this very topic of feminized men. Although the title of the article is funny, this article which is written by a woman hits the nail on the head about how society has changed the standard of masculinity.

 

http://thefederalist.com/2016/07/20/when-t...-first-to-fall/

 

A solid read. Most of the time female writers tend to miss the Catch 22 that is the modern male experience (since they are writing from a female perspective.; that would be like a male writer attempting to fully capture the experience of pregnancy since it is something we can only experience from a limited view). The Catch 22 being "Men are expected to be men, but not really. They should be aggressive and dominating, but only in a way that is controllable and tame, but not too tame or seemingly subdued, because then they're just bitches."

 

The only mean that escape this are the true alpha rock stars that just don't give a flying f*ck. Examples include a lot of professional athlete, actual rock stars or even certain movie stars like Charlie sheen. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Charlie sheen is a model citizen, but no one can deny that they guy lived life on his own terms and did not care what anyone thought or had to say, for his own benefit and demise.

 

Society makes vain attempts to marginalize these outlines but the effects on null: Other men secretly want to live free like these guys do and women will flock in hordes to be with these men.

If there was ever a thread for VIP, this is it...

don't do drugs

WTF is going on on LP lately ? LOL

don't do drugs

 

 

WTF is going on on LP lately ? LOL

 

 

Exactly.

 

JK

If there was ever a thread for VIP, this is it...

 

 

don't do drugs

 

"Drugs are like fat chicks. You can do them, but whenever questioned about it directly deny, deny, deny.

 

WTF is going on on LP lately ? LOL

 

Sign of the times? Though I would be curious on your thoughts about this topic.

Very good thread definitely something that needs to be talked about and definitely not a simple issue.

Does this mean I need to hide my Lionel Richie CD collection?

Does this mean I need to hide my Lionel Richie CD collection?

 

Lionel Ritchie is ok, its the Katy Perry and Taylor Swift that is highly questionable lol

I think most (hetero) mens naturally raise to that same level than our grandfather were. If and when needed.

 

It's good that we dont need to be traumatized from war like almost all of them were.

Granted we get everything for 1/10th of a struggle they did. But I would suggest for anyone to leave the easy internet city life behind for some period and go do hard stuff on wilderness and try to make something physical with your mind and hands.

It's good to give those genes and instincts a workout that normally nowadays sleep all the time.

 

But if occasion rises there will be shortage of real man. That's my thought at least. No amount of talking about changes it. And bitches and beta males have always been moaning about what real man should or should not be. We should not care about that.

Does this mean I need to hide my Lionel Richie CD collection?

 

It depends.

 

The masculine male turns on Lionel Richie when he not so subtly wants to let his lady know, tonight we aren't watching a romantic comedy or Real Housewives, we are going to practice making a baby.

 

The enlightened male turns Lionel Richie on while drinking a glass of wine alone and crying over the guilt he feels for his white male privilege.

 

Which one are you?

 

Compared to how I was brought up and those around me in general and seeing the younger generation and how they are being raised is concerning. But, their is still real men that are raising their son's to be men. Their is a percentage of young males that are real men...just a smaller percentage these days. I work with bro's that are mentors for guys wanting to go into Buds. Their is several throughout the country. We have one in Phoenix and one in Tucson. If you are 17-26 and wanting to go into the military specifically to become a SEAL then you would have your recruiter put you into this mentor program. Here locally it is ran two to three mornings a week at 5 am. It is at an aquatic center. They will do pretty much everything you would do in buds in the h20. The candidate would then need to do the physical screening test to get into buds. If they meet the qual (most instructors want to see you exceed each part of the qual) from the mentor then they will be put into basic and immediately after basic they would go right into Buds (you even know what Buds class you will be in). This reduces the amount of guys ringing the bell and to get a more qualified group of guys in buds. Some strong candidates going thru and of course you get ones that will not show back up after a class or two or more. So, that gives me hope that their are still young men that have what it takes in America.

 

If you are wondering if you are a real man or not these days or if your son is this will help...if you or your son is going around playing pokemon then you are not a "man"...just say'n LOL

It's all women's fault:

 

IMO, this really went off-the-rails in the 1990s, but since then, there are a lot of guys interested in adopting the old man values, if-you-will, hence the popularity of websites like Art of Manliness. There is also a huge resurgence of interest in the old crafts as well, via the Maker Movement and the Internet overall. The dying of these crafts was especially of concern in the late 1980s, but no one foresaw the rise of the Internet and how it would democratize information so much and do things like make old Popular Mechanics magazines and so forth publicly available.

 

We have also seen a huge resurgence of gun rights compared to how it used to be. While some states have gone really crazy, nationally, compared to how things were in the 1950s, 60s, 70s, etc...gun rights have far more support today than they used to.

 

There's also the popularity of sports like MMA, boxing of course, and football. However, we also have a large degree of non-manly men now as not every guy is an alpha and it is acceptable more not to be in comparison to the past.

I think one reason there's this obsession with the past is that we romanticize it a bit much. In the sense that I think back in the 40's and 50's there were a lot of beta men but with a male dominated backdrop and societal expectations, even the more beta male could land a wife and some respect because he lived in a society that was skewed heavily in his favor. Now when the 60's came all of that went out the window and suddenly the beta male was fully exposed for who he is and had no where to run, so instead focused on tearing down the alpha that could still get laid at will by making everything once held in high praise as thing to be ridiculed.

 

Hollywood is a HUGE perpetrator of that. All Disney movies are primarily about girl power and how much dads suck and I do agree with Wheels that in the 90's this became an accepted cultural meme. The idiot husband that the wife puts up with and has to keep in check, the always to busy for his family father that cares more about his career, or the "My wife really wears the pants in this relationship" meme have become common troupes our society plays over and over.

 

I think the guise of "equality" has done more harm than good in the sense that instead of acknowledging there is a difference in genders but that from a civil perspective they should be held equal, we've gone to a point were society has tried to actively tear down the masculine or at least neutralize it. Divorce cases and alimony payments are large evidence of that.

 

As far as playing Lionel Richie music and Pokemon go, I don't think those factor alone determine being a beta, I'd say you need to look at the whole picture and not a hobby. If Arnold Schwarzenegger did both I doubt anyone would question his alpha status. While yes, I think being able to build a fire and live outdoors is an alpha trait, the overall question of is he masculine comes down to mindset. If you hunt, go camping and wrestle bears, but always find yourself apologizing and explaining yourself to your girlfriend/wife, more often that not you'll be perceived as a beta who can't get his sh*t together.

 

If you want an example of an alpha from here I'd say look no further than Salamone. Say what you will, there's a guy who lives his life how he wants to and literally give no f*cks what anyone thinks. And if you look at a lot of the things he does, they're traditionally masculine (fast cars, women, women women, says what he feels apologetically). Actually, I think on this forum we have quite a few members we could lobby into that grouping as well.

Too many soft fruitcakes running around. The girls in their 20's who work for me say they can't even figure out if guys are gay or not anymore. Even on the first date. That is fooked....this picture inspires me every day to keep the testosterone up.

 

 

LOL, sure sure...

 

I'm always amazed when someone is know has me fix simple things for them on their motorcycles because they just have no clue or don't even own tools... changing sparkplugs, changing oil, cleaning carbs...

It's the parent(s), or lack there of, fault. I cannot imagine how my kids would be if I was not around.

It's the parent(s), or lack there of, fault. I cannot imagine how my kids would be if I was not around.

 

 

Parenting media. There are still alphas out there just fewer. It's all a numbers game and guess what ? Evolution will prevail. Bye bye from the genepool.

Too many soft fruitcakes running around. The girls in their 20's who work for me say they can't even figure out if guys are gay or not anymore. Even on the first date. That is fooked....this picture inspires me every day to keep the testosterone up.

 

Send them my way

 

LOL, sure sure...

 

 

memories

 

Parenting media. There are still alphas out there just fewer. It's all a numbers game and guess what ? Evolution will prevail. Bye bye from the genepool.

 

I agree that there certainly are far fewer alphas out there. It'll be interesting to see how this plays out over the next few generations.

 

Sign of the times? Though I would be curious on your thoughts about this topic.

 

Don't have any experience on the men subject so I am sitting this one out LOL.

I'm always amazed when someone is know has me fix simple things for them on their motorcycles because they just have no clue or don't even own tools... changing sparkplugs, changing oil, cleaning carbs...

 

Or maybe are just taking advantage of free labour