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> I really need to buy a new gun...
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kane00
post Apr 9 2010, 12:17 AM
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M-14 is not bad.

I've got a Wilson 1911 that I love and a TJ's Gunworks Sig 220 which might be my favorite gun.

What about a good semi-auto combat shotgun? When shit hits the fan, it will be the best home defense weapon you can have. You can load it with alternate slug and shot rounds for convenient crowd removal or torso removal.
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joebiz
post Apr 9 2010, 12:21 AM
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I just picked up a Baretta CX4 Storm. It's a very strange unit, but actually quite a bit of fun to plink around on.

Essentially it's just a 9mm baretta handgun that they put in an assault-rifle-type-ish skin. Put an EOTech halo sight on it and it's a pretty versatile plinker.

I'd pass at the price point ($800 without the Halo) but Baretta holds its value so well that it doesn't really matter.


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Boner
post Apr 9 2010, 12:23 AM
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If you dont have an ar-15, that would be fun. I think I want my next to be a pistol grip ak-47. I am happy with my mossberg roadblocker:

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Redlambo
post Apr 9 2010, 12:27 AM
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QUOTE (bonedoc @ Apr 8 2010, 09:23 PM) *
If you dont have an ar-15, that would be fun. I think I want my next to be a pistol grip ak-47. I am happy with my mossberg roadblocker:

Attached File  mossberg.jpg ( 195.42K ) Number of downloads: 62


I've got one of those as well. In my opinion it is the best home defense you can have as you do not need to be extremely accurate in your shot, just point to where the noise is and it is no more.


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soup
post Apr 9 2010, 12:44 AM
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Aren't you deaf after you used that shotgun in your house?

I remember this being discussed in the gun thread.
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MasterShake
post Apr 9 2010, 12:49 AM
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IMO, the flash suppressor on the mossberg looks retarded .
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ts640
post Apr 9 2010, 12:52 AM
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QUOTE (TheAmericanStig @ Apr 9 2010, 01:11 AM) *
Any reason behind this?



1) Quality, the quality of the stocks and stock tubes suck, as they are cheap plastic.

2) All the accessories that come with the 556 are horrible quality, and way overpriced.

3) Weight- front heavy, feels somewhat awkward.

4) The mag release is at a horrible location.

5) Small bolt release, no aftermarket alternative.

6) Terrible groups

7) Horrible flash hider/ suppressor mount. This means you'll need a new mount if you wish to use a suppressor .

8) If you need replacement parts have fun, SIG has horrible customer service.

9) It's a wannabe 550/551/552

10) ZERO QUALITY CONTROL . They let anything out of the factory, and they have no customer service. I've picked up numerous 556s that rattle.

Which means you'll end up with a rifle that that isn't what you really want (550), that you basically have to replace everything on to make into what it should have been (550). But it still won't be a 550. It will just be a very expensive gun with an identity crisis.

There are just better ways to spend your money IMHO.
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TheFilipinoStig
post Apr 9 2010, 12:57 AM
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QUOTE (ts640 @ Apr 9 2010, 01:52 AM) *
1) Quality, the quality of the stocks and stock tubes suck, as they are cheap plastic.

2) All the accessories that come with the 556 are horrible quality, and way overpriced.

3) Weight- front heavy, feels somewhat awkward.

4) The mag release is at a horrible location.

5) Small bolt release, no aftermarket alternative.

6) Terrible groups

7) Horrible flash hider/ suppressor mount. This means you'll need a new mount if you wish to use a suppressor .

8) If you need replacement parts have fun, SIG has horrible customer service.

9) It's a wannabe 550/551/552

10) ZERO QUALITY CONTROL . They let anything out of the factory, and they have no customer service. I've picked up numerous 556s that rattle.

Which means you'll end up with a rifle that that isn't what you really want (550), that you basically have to replace everything on to make into what it should have been (550). But it still won't be a 550. It will just be a very expensive gun with an identity crisis.

There are just better ways to spend your money IMHO.


That's too bad. I always associated SIG with quality, (just like Glock or HK). I have yet to actually shoot the 556. I'll stay with my cheap as hell and easy to use AK! I honestly laugh every time I break it down because it is so basic and simple. Plus it packs some punch.

My Colt AR was fun, but I can't see myself buying another one...


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Redlambo
post Apr 9 2010, 01:09 AM
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QUOTE (soup @ Apr 8 2010, 09:44 PM) *
Aren't you deaf after you used that shotgun in your house?

I remember this being discussed in the gun thread.


If I shoot that thing in my house the last thing I am worried about is being deaf.

I have shot mine at the range it is loud but not terribly loud.



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ts640
post Apr 9 2010, 01:40 AM
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QUOTE (TheAmericanStig @ Apr 9 2010, 01:57 AM) *
That's too bad. I always associated SIG with quality, (just like Glock or HK). I have yet to actually shoot the 556. I'll stay with my cheap as hell and easy to use AK! I honestly laugh every time I break it down because it is so basic and simple. Plus it packs some punch.

My Colt AR was fun, but I can't see myself buying another one...



The other SIG products are still quality. The 556 is just the bad apple.


AR-15s become more fun when you start customizing them.


Agree with Kane on the semi auto shotgun. A good pistol, good shotgun, and good rifle great tools to be proficient with.
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Roman
post Apr 9 2010, 01:58 AM
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QUOTE (soup @ Apr 8 2010, 10:44 PM) *
Aren't you deaf after you used that shotgun in your house?

I remember this being discussed in the gun thread.



I have earplugs taped next to the shotgun- Enough for everybody in the family and a few more just to be safe. And glowsticks.


Im kindof leaning towards an M1A... Maybe A Springfield SOCOM or SOCOM2


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Roman
post Apr 9 2010, 02:09 AM
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FWIW, This is what got me jonesing for more toys.... I went out to the range with my friends.... And they have some fun chit.







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Gilligan740
post Apr 9 2010, 02:13 AM
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QUOTE (Redlambo @ Apr 9 2010, 12:27 AM) *
I've got one of those as well. In my opinion it is the best home defense you can have as you do not need to be extremely accurate in your shot, just point to where the noise is and it is no more.


A quick comment. The notion that aiming and accuracy are any less vital in a home defense situation with a shotgun is fairly, well, inaccurate. Yes, you can adjust the choke on your shotgun for a wider spread and you can shoot loads that are easier to hit on target without aiming quite as precisely. However, shotguns in general are more precise than most people assume.

I'll let one of YouTube's gun experts demonstrate.

Shotgun myth part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IR5K3DrD4Lk
Shotgun myth part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4oe6kjvpkg


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ts640
post Apr 9 2010, 02:20 AM
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QUOTE (RomanDad @ Apr 9 2010, 02:58 AM) *
I have earplugs taped next to the shotgun- Enough for everybody in the family and a few more just to be safe. And glowsticks.


Im kindof leaning towards an M1A... Maybe A Springfield SOCOM or SOCOM2



Do it. SOCOMII is good if you want the rails.

If you can find a camo pre ban M1A I'd pick that up. Awesome rifle, and if you need SA to bring it up to spec its quite cheap.SA is an awesome company to deal with for customer service, even with rifles that are 20+ years old.
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KING-640
post Apr 9 2010, 02:37 AM
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Get a CZ. The P07 Duty looks nice.
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Roman
post Apr 9 2010, 03:17 AM
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QUOTE (Milligan740 @ Apr 9 2010, 12:13 AM) *
A quick comment. The notion that aiming and accuracy are any less vital in a home defense situation with a shotgun is fairly, well, inaccurate. Yes, you can adjust the choke on your shotgun for a wider spread and you can shoot loads that are easier to hit on target without aiming quite as precisely. However, shotguns in general are more precise than most people assume.

I'll let one of YouTube's gun experts demonstrate.

Shotgun myth part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IR5K3DrD4Lk
Shotgun myth part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4oe6kjvpkg



Im gonna have to mythbust his myth-busting....

First- I dont know anybody who thinks when you pull the trigger of a shotgun, the wall disappears. Or that the spread is super wide like he suggests.

Second, he fires the shotgun from the various distances and creates a 3-5 inch wide cone of damage. On the target he uses, he OBLITERATES the 10 and 9 rings, and still has shot hitting the outside rings. And then says "So at these distances its basically like a rifle". The BIGGEST rifle round I know of is the .50 BMG and aside from the fact that you would have to be fucking insane to use one of those for home defense (Firing a 40 pound 50 BMG from the shoulder is about as fun as getting punched in the balls, not to mention, everybody in the house would be instantly and permanently deaf, and the fucking windows might be blown out and you would probably kill your neighbors.... three blocks away.) and yet it only creates a single, half inch wide hole in the target that easily fits within the 10 ring, he made DISAPPEAR.

The idea that you "dont have to aim" a shotgun, really means that when you pull that trigger, youve got NINE projectiles leaving the gun.... And they will make a cone of damage about 4-10 inches wide.... WHICH IS A BIG MARGIN OF ERROR for the average shooter under pressure. Only ONE of them has to hit something VITAL for the bad guy to go down....


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Redlambo
post Apr 9 2010, 03:19 AM
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QUOTE (RomanDad @ Apr 8 2010, 10:58 PM) *
I have earplugs taped next to the shotgun- Enough for everybody in the family and a few more just to be safe. And glowsticks.


Im kindof leaning towards an M1A... Maybe A Springfield SOCOM or SOCOM2


In my opinion, fortunately not by firsthand experience I think ear plugs are going to be the last thing on your mind if you need to pull a gun out.
Do you think the cops are going to put ear plugs in before they grab for their gun? Hell no!

Let me just put this scenario out. It is the middle of the night and you hear someone downstairs.

You jump up out of bed (if you are like me you are butt ass naked).
You wake your wife up, who by the way is already up because you just jumped the F_ck out of bed.
The conversation is quick "call the cops". No, "honey I think someone is down stairs if you hear something call the cops, I'll be back".
Now I ask you are you going to put ear plugs in when you grab for your gun in the dark? Your butt ass naked and your adrenalin is pumping.
You grab you gun and march downstairs hoping that whoever it is will leave fast.
Again if you are like me you cannot even chamber a round because there is one already in the chamber with the safety on.
Me myself, I think I would just say get the fcuk out of here I have a gun and my wife just called the cops.

Vic

PS: And sorry the glow sticks have to go to, the last thing I want to be is a glow in the dark target.


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Redlambo
post Apr 9 2010, 03:37 AM
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QUOTE (Milligan740 @ Apr 8 2010, 11:13 PM) *
A quick comment. The notion that aiming and accuracy are any less vital in a home defense situation with a shotgun is fairly, well, inaccurate.


Research has shown that in most incidents when a gun is used the average distance is 5 to 10 feet.
Also with a moss burg 500 which is the gun I have not the Roadblocker, I believe the barrel is 18.5" which is less than that of a regular 12 gauge.

The last time I went out and shot I destroyed a 2' x 2' x 2' cardboard box from about 25 feet.
Hell you could point the thing at an angle to the floor and the shot that would ricochet up from the slab would be crippling.
If you are terribly inaccurate you have six more shells in the damn thing. After you discharge the first round anyone left standing will be running the opposite way even if their on PCP, Meth and Crack.



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Gilligan740
post Apr 9 2010, 04:34 AM
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QUOTE (RomanDad @ Apr 9 2010, 03:17 AM) *
Im gonna have to mythbust his myth-busting....

First- I dont know anybody who thinks when you pull the trigger of a shotgun, the wall disappears. Or that the spread is super wide like he suggests.

Second, he fires the shotgun from the various distances and creates a 3-5 inch wide cone of damage. On the target he uses, he OBLITERATES the 10 and 9 rings, and still has shot hitting the outside rings. And then says "So at these distances its basically like a rifle". The BIGGEST rifle round I know of is the .50 BMG and aside from the fact that you would have to be fucking insane to use one of those for home defense (Firing a 40 pound 50 BMG from the shoulder is about as fun as getting punched in the balls, not to mention, everybody in the house would be instantly and permanently deaf, and the fucking windows might be blown out and you would probably kill your neighbors.... three blocks away.) and yet it only creates a single, half inch wide hole in the target that easily fits within the 10 ring, he made DISAPPEAR.

The idea that you "dont have to aim" a shotgun, really means that when you pull that trigger, youve got NINE projectiles leaving the gun.... And they will make a cone of damage about 4-10 inches wide.... WHICH IS A BIG MARGIN OF ERROR for the average shooter under pressure. Only ONE of them has to hit something VITAL for the bad guy to go down....


I'll agree that his assertion that it is "like a rifle" is generally incorrect but if you have never fired a shotgun before and are basing your idea of spread on Hollywood's portrayal of a shotgun you might be in for a rude awakening. Just don't want anyone to be naive when it counts!


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BLK85
post Apr 9 2010, 04:43 AM
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QUOTE (RomanDad @ Apr 9 2010, 02:09 AM) *

How hard is it to get a full auto in California?


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