Smash Boy

Rolled eyes eh? Ok. Let's play. -Honda built that jet simply to demonstrate their technical prowess in engine efficiency, they have no desire, nor the means, to market it as an entire package (green aircraft, etc), and have said so repeatedly. At best they're hoping to recoup the investment via an entry into the possible micro-engine market for small/personal jets that are expected to arrive on the scene within the next decade. Bottom line: tech demonstrator, not intended for production. -Honda refused for years in the mid to late 90s to deploy a V8 engine to market in any product, despite a constant request from their North American operations brass to do so in the Acura Legend/RL line. They cited many variables, all of them extremely conservative in nature, particularly in the areas of fuel consumption and increased emissions. Even as both Toyota and Nissan produced V8 engines in competitor products, Honda stood their ground and let marketshare erode. Bottom line: Despite the near extinction of Acura at the high-end in North American markets, Honda's board still refuses to admit that V8 engines are a viable powerplant choice in today's high-end sedans. -Honda refused to develop, or endorse, rear wheel drive systems in luxury sedans, despite the outcry of consumers around the globe preferring it in their medium sedans. Honda ignored surging sales at MB and BMW in the late 90s, and into this decade, and only recently acquiesed regarding finally putting an AWD compromise system in their high-end sedans. Bottom line: Honda didn't "like" RWD powertrain systems, because they were possibly "dangerous" in difficult conditions. Sounds pretty conservative to me sport. Roll your eyes at that. <-stupid

Look guys, I'm not a rebel. I do love Ferrari, sure....but I love Lamborghini equally....never considered owning a Countach...now it's on my top 3 or 4 for first exotic. Where I have beef is that I've driven these cars myself and didn't encounter these problems. Secondly, I've got Countach and Diablo owning friends who've driven (and in some cases owned) the F cars I mentioned, and they had nice things to say about it. They've told me they prefer their Lambos, for stylistic or adrenaline pumping reasons, but praised the braking and steering of the Ferraris. As far as intangibles are concerned, they exist mostly in the exotic car category (and especially in the older ones). They have a place, for me at least. Why I have to be denied that importance, I don't understand. And if this is the board that "keeps it real", let me throw out what I've been told by these Countach/Diablo guys. "NSX....great car. Never drove a car before where I approach the performance limits so quickly after a few minutes of seat time. Would love to have it as a daily driver, but wouldn't own it over an exotic. I don't see it entertaining me for the long haul." "Gallardo....very competent car. But it feels like a 500 hp Celica, being so easy to drive, etc , etc, etc". Not looking to stir up beefs with you guys....all the cars we talked about have their different strengths. Vettes and Vipers provide thrills no exotics can match, and vice versa. Newer cars have all the performance in the world, but older cars have their charms. I don't know what else to say. Mako, when are you coming to NYC so we can argue over beers?

Only on a Lambo board will you hear extreme derogatory things about the 348 and 355.....and other Ferraris. Shit, Ferruccio Lamborghini, with every right in the world to say the worst things about Ferrari, actually was quite complimentary of the marque (see interviews in other section). Perhaps these cars could be overrated by Ferrari owners, the automotive press, non-owning tifosi, etc.......it's believable. But "POS"...."i've only heard terrible things"....LOL. These remarks are consistent responses to all things Ferrari on this board, whether you guys want to admit it or not. Remember, there are pretty much two categories of enthusiasts (with some overlap of course, depending on mood): A) By the #s, performance at all costs Appreciates #s, but seeks the intangibles for maximum satisfaction The overwhelming majority of L/P is clearly group A....which is why I'm always in disagreement with everybody! Those EVOs and STIs are lookin' kinda hot SON!

Silver Seraph = boring. Arnage = exciting. Peter, can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not, but in case you aren't....now you know Shah, that yellow one is something else isn't it?? I've never seen a Conti T in yellow. Stunning, although I'm not sure if it's appropriate Agreed that it's the top Bentley. Let's not forget what the MSRP on these cars were.

So, would you place a Countach QV as a better handling car than a 348?

God bless Alois Ruf!!

A favorite of mine. Sure to draw mixed reviews!! I'd go with some large 20"+ rims, polished or maybe chrome, depending on mood, hehe. Anyone know the market value for one of these badboys? Is this a future $70k car?

Here are some pics

Mako, I want 4/6 F40 aura at 1/6 the price....the only exotics I can foresee owning in the near future are the 3 series F cars, Countach, TR, etc. I'm not big balla like you & the other guys yet. And you're right on all counts about out & out performance of 348 versus those other cars. Those cars you mentioned are cool (and I'd like to have a Plastic mess-06 or Viper out of that list), but none of them classify as exotic cars, for better or worse. Call me crazy, but I actually enjoy the whole awkward shift gate, non power steering, high revving motor experience, and I'm not exactly all by myself in this category! :supz: As for the Aston Martin Vantage 600 being "ugly as hell", that's all in the eye of the beholder of course. It's charming in a muscle car kinda way......if you are a fan of muscle cars you would understand totally where I'm coming from. 600 hp/600 lb-ft of torque since the '90s is something Aston has yet to equal....and I know you wouldn't turn down a drive either! Aram, as far as your assessment of the 348 cars, which ones have you driven? The pre-Serie Speciale cars ('89-92) have quirky, oversteer issues, which were corrected on the later cars ('93 SS, '94 , '95). Those updates can be made to the early cars if needed. Through years of battle testing, a lot of the issues for 348s have been worked out by the owners. I've never tracked a 348 so I'm in no position to disagree with you on at the limit handling, but I'd wager you'd say the same things about a 355 or 360, so what's the point in arguing. You guys are a tough crowd!

Now the question is: When will MB add a third pedal to their transmission lineup??

I hear great things about the handling of the challenge cars....supposedly capable of outlapping stock 355 & 360s around tracks. And you can pick them up at decent prices... Was wondering if they are relatively streetable??

The Quattroporte may not be as bulletproof as the other cars, but the driving experience should be head & shoulders above the 760, S class, and A8. The target car the engineers based their design on was the previous generation BMW M5. All this talk of being Lamborghini owners, and being exclusive, and you all write off the only exclusive 4 door in the sub Bentley/RR/Maybach category. Give it a legitimate shot before bashing it...

Man, these AMG guys have no quit in them! Mercedes is clearly at the hp/torque forefront thanks to them. They're very flexible in their motors, be it supercharging, turbocharging, and/or large displacement. Now they need to release an even better naturally aspirated V12.

600 hp/600 lb-ft, with the braking to match! It's not elegant looking like some of the other cars, but it's like a British muscle car!

Apologies gentlemen....here's a PROPER LINK: http://www.astonmartins.com/virage/v600.htm and if you can put up with supercars.net again...here's one in green: http://www.supercars.net/cars/82.html

Mostly because they weren't sold here... But I love these! Sorry for the poor link, but here's a pic of it: http://www.supercars.net/cars/83.html Anyone have an idea how much they are worth?

Cool. Thanks! But I believe there are certain mileage restrictions for "show and display", no?

Amusing how the SL65 vs. Viper battle lasted as long as it did... Fast lap times are a result of balance......acceleration, braking, handling. If anything is to improve the lap times the most, it would be the latter two. A Ferrari 360 CS, Porsche 911 GT3 are good examples of this, as their braking and suspension are world class, while having modest (compared to supercars) power. These two cars lap tracks faster than most cars, save the super exotics. If it's true that a 360 CS can lap Fiorano only 2 seconds slower than an Enzo, that would be amazing. Having a lot of power can help, but won't do the trick.......except maybe in Nurburbring, a 7+ mile course with many many corners and straights. I guess if the benz has amazing braking (even with all that weight), and can stick some good lateral Gs (maybe .90+), then it can lap competitively with the big boys perhaps.

What about a Denali or Denali XL?? Classier than Escalade, maybe better quality as well. And if it means anything, the GM trucks take to customizing (rims, sound systems) far better than the others.

Question: Jota, how were you able to bring the 412 P onto the streets?!! And on a related note, how was that GTR on the streets of Beverly Hills as well?

You guys are so anti-Ferrari!! If that was a Miura that set on fire, nobody would be talkin' shh!!

C6 Plastic mess-06, with 10k miles, being $35k in 3 years??? Would be nice, but doubt it. Don't think you could get a C5 Plastic mess-06 with 10k miles, '02 model for that price, can you?

Carb cars of the '70s have issues....I've heard problems with Miuras, Ghiblis, etc catching fire as well.

Actually, it uses two 308 engines. And I'm pretty sure that this car was THE original Lamborghini Diablo design. If you look at lambocars.com, and search for it, you'll see these pics as the prototype design before Chrysler took over and made alterations. So imagine that....this could very well have been the Diablo many of you own today.