last time.....tubi or kresseig? old thread was locked! why?

i just got my Kresseig tonight...

 

It is totally redesigned!!!! nothing like the pictures on Kresssigs web site. should i be excited? or worried? it came with new cats, and no provision to keep the factory cats. the valves are in a diffrent area, and all the piping is laid out diffrently. I will take several photos this week end, and see if I can post them right away. I am worried about several plates/ hole diameter diffrences inside the actual system right near the 4 tale pipes. it looks as if restrictor pates were added to muffle the sound. or just restrict the actual flow in the system when in stock mode AND in the F1 mode.

 

I feel that I need more concrete info form the manufacturer. (phone call in the AM) and i will have to dyno test before and after the install.

 

very basic (no pictures) instructions, and the packaging had lots of japanese newspapers used as shipping cushions (must have been assymbled in Japan)- BTW- the welding looks excellent.

 

also... the supplied cats look as if they are straight thru, no real cat system at all, just a small "sample" area for the O2 sensor. i will get pics ASAP. does this mean that we cannot pass emissions when in the "quiet" mode? thats is why I spent over 10k for the system, isn't it?

I think that you should be excited.

 

I chatted with the folks at Kreis-sieg a few weeks ago about the system and they said that as the result of the testing we did they modified the system for the Gallardo and the 360 to address the check engine light concern that had been seen by others in the past. They also shared that the initially the modifications were made to the original system however once the issues were understood....and addressed then a complete system based on the changed was fabricated. They felt it better to do this when compared to simply creating a patch work quilt of sorts by modifing the original.

 

I know that most folks are at SEMA this week so some of your answers will probably have to wait a few days. As for the cats; they are the same size l (length, and fit wise) as OEM and it is my understanding that either can be used. However if you use the new RACE cats they have been designed so as to work with the OEM engine management system again without tossing check engine lights.

 

I have not seen pictures of or the newly completed system up close and personal (except for the cats; these I saw a picture of) I was only told of it so I too would like to see some pictures and I then I suspect that I can answer your questions for you.

 

Lastly, there should have been an installation CD....... but I can share that it contains limited information so I can probably better serve you or ?? with the installation with a couple phone conversations.

 

Takes care

 

Shadowman

i just got my Kresseig tonight...

 

It is totally redesigned!!!! nothing like the pictures on Kresssigs web site. should i be excited? or worried? it came with new cats, and no provision to keep the factory cats. the valves are in a diffrent area, and all the piping is laid out diffrently. I will take several photos this week end, and see if I can post them right away. I am worried about several plates/ hole diameter diffrences inside the actual system right near the 4 tale pipes. it looks as if restrictor pates were added to muffle the sound. or just restrict the actual flow in the system when in stock mode AND in the F1 mode.

 

I feel that I need more concrete info form the manufacturer. (phone call in the AM) and i will have to dyno test before and after the install.

 

very basic (no pictures) instructions, and the packaging had lots of japanese newspapers used as shipping cushions (must have been assymbled in Japan)- BTW- the welding looks excellent.

 

also... the supplied cats look as if they are straight thru, no real cat system at all, just a small "sample" area for the O2 sensor. i will get pics ASAP. does this mean that we cannot pass emissions when in the "quiet" mode? thats is why I spent over 10k for the system, isn't it?

 

Did you have to sign a waiver from Omni Solutions before you received your exhaust system? Just curious to know because that waiver states emission and no CEL is not a gurantee...glad you got your exhaust in though! Who's gonna be doing the install? As far as quiet mode goes..when we tested it on Alex's 6.0, we had a loss of over 100 WHP. I have the dyno if anyone wants to see it...

-Mark

the issuse i have concerns with lie in the exhust tip. there is a small hole, approx 1" in diameter where the "quiet mode" fumes exit the muffler into the actual exhaust tip area. this is where the two pipes merege, it just looks as if the welder didn't take time to enlarge the hole after the weld was complete. this restriction is appox half of the actual pipe diameter. to further complicate the flow of fumes, there is a half circle plate welded into the diameter of the exhaust just where the single pipe splits into the dual tips. the result looks to me like the "quiet mode" is restricted by 50% or so, and just as it is forced thru the smaller diameter, it must the bounce off the half circle baffle (which will caust the air flow to reverse) and them be forced out the back.

 

I would feel all of the "final complications" would severly restrict the flow in quiet mode, and the half circle plate is causing a 50% blockage in the "F1 mode" too.

 

i will get pictures tomorrow. i have to go make some money to day, cause the kids gotta eat...

the issuse i have concerns with lie in the exhust tip. there is a small hole, approx 1" in diameter where the "quiet mode" fumes exit the muffler into the actual exhaust tip area. this is where the two pipes merege, it just looks as if the welder didn't take time to enlarge the hole after the weld was complete. this restriction is appox half of the actual pipe diameter. to further complicate the flow of fumes, there is a half circle plate welded into the diameter of the exhaust just where the single pipe splits into the dual tips. the result looks to me like the "quiet mode" is restricted by 50% or so, and just as it is forced thru the smaller diameter, it must the bounce off the half circle baffle (which will caust the air flow to reverse) and them be forced out the back.

 

I would feel all of the "final complications" would severly restrict the flow in quiet mode, and the half circle plate is causing a 50% blockage in the "F1 mode" too.

 

i will get pictures tomorrow. i have to go make some money to day, cause the kids gotta eat...

 

As stated above, in quiet mode, you're going to lose horsepower. I hope you weren't told other wise. That mode is only to be used in a situation where you need the car to be "quiet." And, as asked last night, did you have to sign a waiver on the exhaust system? The more feedback the better!

 

-Mark

Hi Mark:

 

The waiver you mention was changed; please call me directly with any questions and I can fill in the blanks.

 

BTW; why was the original thread locked??? This question was never answered and the thread was not only a good one........ but had the basis for continuing dialog.

 

Shadowman

Hi Mark:

 

The waiver you mention was changed; please call me directly with any questions and I can fill in the blanks.

 

BTW; why was the original thread locked??? This question was never answered and the thread was not only a good one........ but had the basis for continuing dialog.

 

Shadowman

 

 

Changed how? I don't see how Ima2nr's waiver would OR should be any different from the waiver that MANA had to have signed and FAXED back (twice) to Omni Solutions/Eisenhaus. The waiver clearly states that they are not responsible for CEL and or SMOG Emissions. Funny how the waiver came about because after purchasing 3-4 units from Omni/Eisenhaus, we never had to sign anything until we ran into the problems with the CEL. You supposedly fixed it on the Gallardo. Yet, even though "YOU" solved the problem, we were still required and not 100% guranteed that no CEL would come about.

 

And..I locked the thread for the reason being that you were using it to your advantage as far as an ADVERTISEMENT. You go straight to your site and that's the first thing people see, KREISSIEG. Granted, you did the install and showed everyone, but you made it very clear that you were selling it and would sell it. And look, you did happen to sell it to IMA2NR. What a coincidence!? Not to mention, you contacted my customers directly which was a BIG PROBLEM with us as well. There was no need for you to PM Mana, BMWRACER and tell them that you yourself were working out the problem behind our company's back. You could have called me directly and said hey Mark, we're getting it fixed, let the guys know. I've bit my tongue for too long. You know what you did and you know what you're doing. You claim you don't need the business of the forums, but yet you advertise here, and Ferrarichat in your sneeky little ways to get more business. If things are that bad for you, I'm sorry. I wish you more luck in the future.

 

-Mark

I have PM'd you Mark.

 

BTW, the waiver was changed.... it no longer has those comments in it.

 

Let's chat

 

Shadowman

I have PM'd you Mark.

 

BTW, the waiver was changed.... it no longer has those comments in it.

 

Let's chat

 

Shadowman

 

No need. I've said all I have to say. If things have changed for you great, but I don't see what's so different with you and I when it comes to purchasing the same product.

Here's the waiver:

Wow....... I am saddened by the fact that this thread has taken a left turn....

 

Mark:

 

As I stated this is "NO LONGER" the waiver....... and not the waiver I have ever used; it was changed drastically.

 

Regards

 

Shadowman

i'm looking for my copy, but that looks exactly like the waiver I had to sign.

 

why should a "stock mode sound" cause the car to lose an additional 100hp approx? that seems like poor engineering. I would like to speak to someone (possibly one of the designers) and ask why the tiny holes for the stock mode, and the 50% half restrictor plate in the exhaust tip for the full f1 mode AND stock mode.

 

I feel that for DOUBLE the cost of a tubi, I should have a well designed / dyno tested and proven system.

 

please understand, the system looks to have huge potential. and it may not lose any horsepower, as it has not been tested yet. but I did build racing motors for several years, have been an ASE certified mechanic for approx 15 yrs, and owned my own speed shop for approx 5 yrs. I have left that industry, but the knowledge is still with me, and the issues I have stated seem to be big ones, although pretty easy enough to correct with a little work.

 

I would like to ask, can some one form the manufacture please LOGICALLY explain why the restrictions and baffles are in the exhaust tip?

 

will my car pass emmissions with these "race cats" when i was sold the system with the idea that i could flip a switch and be smog legal.

 

why if there are no CEL or smog issuse was I asked to sign the same waiver as the one SP_wEaZeL posted on this thread?

 

I'm not mad... Ijust want exactly what I was promised. I spent alot of money for me, and I deserve to recieve the goods as described before the purchase. (example - if you tell me I'm buying a ford, and you deliver a chevy, that's not what I bought, even though you might argue I wanted to buy a car, and you delivered a car)

 

I should not have to lose hp (the web site says +20 to 30 hp), re-engineer the system, or simple be disappointed after spending a grand to have the thing installed.

i'm looking for my copy, but that looks exactly like the waiver I had to sign.

 

why should a "stock mode sound" cause the car to lose an additional 100hp approx? that seems like poor engineering. I would like to speak to someone (possibly one of the designers) and ask why the tiny holes for the stock mode, and the 50% half restrictor plate in the exhaust tip for the full f1 mode AND stock mode.

 

I feel that for DOUBLE the cost of a tubi, I should have a well designed / dyno tested and proven system.

 

please understand, the system looks to have huge potential. and it may not lose any horsepower, as it has not been tested yet. but I did build racing motors for several years, have been an ASE certified mechanic for approx 15 yrs, and owned my own speed shop for approx 5 yrs. I have left that industry, but the knowledge is still with me, and the issues I have stated seem to be big ones, although pretty easy enough to correct with a little work.

 

I would like to ask, can some one form the manufacture please LOGICALLY explain why the restrictions and baffles are in the exhaust tip?

 

will my car pass emmissions with these "race cats" when i was sold the system with the idea that i could flip a switch and be smog legal.

 

why if there are no CEL or smog issuse was I asked to sign the same waiver as the one SP_wEaZeL posted on this thread?

 

I'm not mad... Ijust want exactly what I was promised. I spent alot of money for me, and I deserve to recieve the goods as described before the purchase. (example - if you tell me I'm buying a ford, and you deliver a chevy, that's not what I bought, even though you might argue I wanted to buy a car, and you delivered a car)

 

I should not have to lose hp (the web site says +20 to 30 hp), re-engineer the system, or simple be disappointed after spending a grand to have the thing installed.

 

I'm sure whoever you bought it from can explain it to you better. Those who have the exhaust know that you must not drive the car with the valvetronic closed. It blocks the passage of exhaust gases causing the loss of power. That may not be the quote on quote correct answer, but that's the logical theory. The valvetronic is only meant for the exhaust sound to be silenced in cases needed. Your car will not pass with the race cats. I'm almost 100% sure of that. I mean, just look @ the waiver we had to have signed. And, our point was, why do our customers after spending a good amount of $$$ have to modify something that should already be perfect?

car will not pass smog with those cats on the car,you can close the flap and try,may b that it will,not sure,i know on my diablo 6.0 dint pass.

alex

Will be interesting to see how Eisenhaus/Omnisource handles this - awhile back they were touting themselves as the "GruppeM" NA importer, after losing that battle, they completely dissed the product (even though there were no issues with it) in order to create a bad rep for GruppeM. Thankfully for those of us who've been in the industry, we know high quality product regardless of rumors. Sounds like bad business (again) in my book - thankfully I've not dealt with Eisenhaus/Omnisource since...

Now I'm all korn-fused...I was set to get the Kresseig for my G-car after following the last thread and looking into the system ...so now we're saying that the cars won't pass smog in any mode??? Can someone help me out here?

Now I'm all korn-fused...I was set to get the Kresseig for my G-car after following the last thread and looking into the system ...so now we're saying that the cars won't pass smog in any mode??? Can someone help me out here?

 

There has been much shared in this thread; the good .... the bad..... and the ugly however there is also some that is openly stated as being based on speculation.

 

For me this turned into a very disaapointing thread; having shared this to answer your question. Yes; a Kreis-sieg exhaust can be installed on your car and still retain the ability to pass smog should this be of importance.

 

FYI, I just had a couple folks over this afternoon for the sole purpose of hearing the gal of mine make some beautiful music. To a person they said...... oh my gosh....... that is simply awesome sounding.

 

Enjoy your car

 

Shadowman.

I have signed the waiver and faxed it twice. I paid for the damn thing a long time ago and still have no idea when I'll ever see it. I am very dissapointed.

I would like to know the opinions regarding performance of K system.

Now I'm all korn-fused...I was set to get the Kresseig for my G-car after following the last thread and looking into the system ...so now we're saying that the cars won't pass smog in any mode??? Can someone help me out here?

i will try to help,

i have the exhaust on my car 6.0 diablo plus headers,if you like the sound of the exhaust,yes its the best sound i have hear,as for smog,when you have the cats open,will not pass smog,and 100whp is down,but if you want spand 10g on a exhaust just for sound makes no power,then i say you go for it,if you want some of the dyno sheet we have you can pm me.

thanks

alex

So who are these questions asked of????? I hope that I can remain politically correct with my responses.

 

With regards to Mana; why your system has not been shipped????? I have no idea, what I do know is that I was told that the system has been in a box awaiting shipping for a couple weeks. I would ask those that you exchanged value with.

 

Now to Murcie Gallardo Tako; as to the performance solicted in association with the Kreis-sieg system..... with the system in F1 mode. I have been told 20-30 HP....... personally I tend to be somewhat conservative and would be happy with 20ish which is comperable to the SE's performance improvement claims that has a slightly restrictive OEM muffler. Having shared this; I was very happy with the way my gal ran before the system was installed however I felt that she needed to express herself a bit more....... meaning she needed a better sounding exhaust system which is exactly what the Kreis-sieg system did......

 

Lastly; I have said more than once in this thread that this particular thread seems to have gone in a very strange direction. The original question was long ago over shadowed and since that point numerous other issues and questions seemed to have cropped up.

 

It has been my experience that specific questions associated with product deliveries should be addressed off this forum with those involved, that frustration with another should be dealt with that person and that technical advise should be given by those that have walked the walk.

 

Best regards

 

Shadowman

I have signed the waiver and faxed it twice.  I paid for the damn thing a long time ago and still have no idea when I'll ever see it.  I am very dissapointed.

 

Bill, I will make sure if nothing is resolved by next week, then the only other way is to take legal action. SP will stand behind you 100%.

yes! i will 100% back that up.

alex

Just do the Tubi + Larini

 

I love mine!!!!!

ok. here are the pics. I'm not a photographer, but I hope they make sense.

 

I feel the system might have been designed in one place (maybe europe?). and the drawings or plans sent to another place for low cost manufacture (japan?).

I want to say for the record; that the craftmanship looks excellent. the welds are flawless, the internal seams were ground smooth wit a dremel style tool, and the parts fit beautifully. I have installed 100's of aftermarket parts on cars (honda, mitsubishi, corvettes, mustangs, etc) and this product is of the highest quality.

 

I said it was assymbled eslewhere because I believe I have discovered an incorrectly installed plate in the exhuast tip. I could be wrong, but if it is installed improperly, it is a very simple fix. please review the pictures attached carefully, and you will see where I feel the plate that is welded in was originally (by the designer) supposed to smooth the airflow at the the last bend/ angle in the exhaust. but due to a possible misundertanding of the plans/ drawings, it was welded on the wrong end (1.5 inched away) of a tube section during the assymble, causing it to become a restriction instead of improving the air flow. it seem very reasonable that this was a simple error on the part of the welder, who is most likely not an air flow theory engineer.

 

KEVIN P.