Need Help 6.0 Diablo Starting Problem

Hi Everyone, I hope someone can direct me to what my problem might be.

 

For a long time I thought this was an alarm problem but I think I can rule it out. Every time I take the car out for a ride... if I stop anywhere & try to turn it back on it won't start!!!! nothing at all.... no crank.. nothing!!!! The lights come on the dash & everything seems to be normal but it won't turn on. I thought this was alarm problem.... so I would arm the alarm... wait 15 minutes..... and the car would start with no problem.... till the other day.

 

I took the car out on a very hot day & after about a 45 min ride I stopped for gas..... Tried to start it back after i was done fueling..... nothing... dead!!! I armed the alarm.. waited 15 tried again.. nothing.... did it again another 15 min... nothing.... After just about 1hr... tried for the last time before calling a flat bed.... it started!!!!! This happens to me many times but the car usually starts after 15 minutes. Now that the summer is here & is very hot its taking longer.

 

When the car is completely cold. I can start many times on & off with no problem.

 

It's getting really annoying getting stuck at gas stations for 15/30 minutes. It happens everytime. Anyone have any idea what this is???

 

Thank You!!!!

A loose battery cable at the battery terminals can cause an intermittent problem like that.

 

Try tightening those up. Use extreme caution that your wrench does not come in to contact with anything while doing the positive side (+).

 

 

Thank You. I will check the battery terminals but why only when car is hot?

If that doesn't solve the problem I suggest you have the starter checked.

Do you hear the solenoid click?

 

http://www.lambopower.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=54632

 

As stated, start with battery terminal connections, then battery connection to ground. Do you know if the battery itself is good? Hope it's not starter.

It may be the starter motor, and if so a rebuild is in order.

Do you hear the solenoid click?

 

http://www.lambopower.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=54632

 

As stated, start with battery terminal connections, then battery connection to ground. Do you know if the battery itself is good? Hope it's not starter.

 

I think this is exactly my problem. I have heard a clicking sound right behind the rear window. Thanks for the link

 

Rgds,

Jim

Thank You. I will check the battery terminals but why only when car is hot?

 

 

Expansion due to heat.

 

 

 

After re-reading your post I am positive (pun intended) the starter is your problem.

 

Lambo starter on e-bay:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Lamborghini...=item3a66b87451

Electrical malfunctions can get worse with excessive heat or with excessive cold --- depends on the type of component and the nature of the failure.

 

Check the simple stuff first. Visually inspect all the electrical connections you can access in the "starting" system ---- battery, starter motor (and solenoid), ignition switch, etc. Check for any loose or corroded connections, and repair them if found.

 

After doing that.....If the problem persists, and if your battery is good (and fully charged), but the car will not even crank at all, it's most likely 1 (or more) of these 3 components failing ---

 

1) Starter

2) Starter Solenoid

3) Ignition Switch

 

If you turn the key to the start position and here only ONE click, and hear only ONE more click when you release the key, the Solenoid is likely okay. If you hear multiple clicks or "chattering", the Solenoid is likely bad.

 

Best way to test the ignition switch is to bypass it by removing the harness connector and manually jumper the starter circuit --- you will need a wiring diagram, or someone's first-hand knowledge of the wiring, for that check. If the starter spins, the switch is likely bad.

 

If the solenoid and ignition tests are both ok, you've isolated the failure to the starter motor.

 

And, while I suppose this (see below) is a good price as compared to buying a new one from Lambo......

 

Lambo starter on e-bay:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Lamborghini...=item3a66b87451

 

It is ridiculous for a rebuilt Bosch starter (of any model) ---- take your starter off the car, and send it to a shop that rebuilds Bosch units ----- many good ones out there. There is nothing "Lambo-unique" about that starter (other than Lambo's price ), and it can be rebuilt for $200-300 by any shop that specializes and can source Bosch starter components.

 

Good Luck ---- and, let us know what you find out

Thanks everyone for all your input. I think I have a grip on the problem. Solenoid or starter.

 

 

Thanks!!!!

Too much easy advice on starter removal, I suspect the ones giving it have never faced the job. You should try the solenoid boost relay first. I was skeptical but it cured the problem enough to avoid this most difficult task, maybe until an engine pull is really necessary.

Too much easy advice on starter removal, I suspect the ones giving it have never faced the job. You should try the solenoid boost relay first. I was skeptical but it cured the problem enough to avoid this most difficult task, maybe until an engine pull is really necessary.

 

 

That's exactly what im gonna try to do. I sent a pm to Albert to get more info on doing that. Im waiting for his reply.

 

Thank You!!!!! I've been so frustrated about this for a year.

 

Rgds,

Jim

QUOTE (IlToro @ Jul 16 2011, 04:14 AM)

 

Too much easy advice on starter removal, I suspect the ones giving it have never faced the job. You should try the solenoid boost relay first. I was skeptical but it cured the problem enough to avoid this most difficult task, maybe until an engine pull is really necessary.

 

That's exactly what im gonna try to do. I sent a pm to Albert to get more info on doing that. Im waiting for his reply.

 

Thank You!!!!! I've been so frustrated about this for a year.

 

Rgds,

Jim

 

Hello jc60diablo,

 

Why not take a comprehensive approach to your problem and try the solenoid boost relay first as suggested; then if the problem is not resolved rebuild the starte. If still unresolved replace the Starter Solenoid & Ignition Switch . If you do some research you should be able tocross reference an alternative replacment part from another model or maker. Just a thought.

IF you do have to get the starter out of there, don't even think about rebuilding it and leaving the solenoid alone. Not to beat a dead horse, but if I was going to take it out, the whole assembly would be replaced NEW. Not worth facing it more than once, and re-built stuff is NOT new.

I’ve owned my 6.0 for about 6 years now and it’s been nearly flawless. 6.0's are now nearly 11 years old an I think it’s time for them to start acting up. I have talked to several 6.0 owners who are now starting to experience the same problem. Intermittent starting problems. Including me. Not like your problem but it will crank like hell but not start. Last year for the first time it happened to me. It would crank but not start. In the end........................ At that time the answer seemed to be replace/remove the fuel cutoff valves. Other people had similar problem with them. I opted to replace them with inertia valves. As I said you can crank it but you would not smell any gas. So it seemed logical. Once replaced it worked fine. A couple of months ago I pulled it out of storage from the winter and the battery was dead. No biggie. Replaced the batter, it would crank but not start. Hmmm. Hit the fob several times while cranking the car and suddenly it started. Didn’t think much of it. A couple of months later went to Pocono. Everything worked fine then suddenly it would not start on Sunday morning on the way home. Crank, and crank, and crank. Nothing. No smell of gas either. Hmmmm. The one thing I did notice was that when you turn the key and press the fob I hear a click (relay?) From under the passenger side of the dash but now no click!?!?!? Fob worked fine as it still locked and un-locked the doors. So I now did the same thing again cranked it while hitting the fob. Finally it kicked. Ran like shit for about 15-30 seconds and then straightened out. Ran fine all the way home. Have not had a problem since then but now I learly when ever I take it out. I need to get it over to Wil’s and have him poke around. Need to get to the bottom of this one. Anybody any thoughts?

Well the first thought is that with all that cranking your going to burn the starter up. Sorry.

 

It sounds like an intermittent connection, maybe a relay that controls the fuel pumps? Or the security system? I would disable that thing if possible. However, just because you didn't smell gas doesn't mean it wasn't there. Unlike a carbureted engine.

Too much easy advice on starter removal, I suspect the ones giving it have never faced the job. You should try the solenoid boost relay first. I was skeptical but it cured the problem enough to avoid this most difficult task, maybe until an engine pull is really necessary.

 

Hey ---- I never said R&R of the starter was easy! But, if it has to be done.....it has to be done. It could be worse, some cars (Ferrari Daytona, for example) require removal of one of the exhaust headers to get the starter off the car ----- now that's a "fun" 9-hour job

 

BTW, the starter and solenoid (Bosch units) are sold, rebuilt, serviced as an assembly --- not as 2 discrete components. So, if you suspect either, it does not matter which, you are pulling the assembly and replacing / rebuilding both.

 

FTR, I was not aware that car had a separate, remote starter relay --- the main relay is built-in to the solenoid on Bosch starters. So, if that's the case (and, I do not doubt you are correct), add the relay to my list as item "4", and check it out as well. If it's easy to get to, it's easy to test ---- jump the primary terminals with 12VDC, and check for continuity between the secondary terminals.

 

Anyone got a picture of the location of the relay? I'm just curious.....

Thanks for all your the advice. I'm definately going to try the solenoid boost relay. I really think this is going to cure it. If not I will tackle the starter. I will keep you guys posted, Thanks again!!

Finally my nightmare is over!!!!! I can not believe how stupid this problem was.... It turns out the ground wire of the starter relay behind my drivers seat was loose.

 

Thank you guys for all your input & thanks to Steve Arena from Arena Motors.

 

 

Finally my nightmare is over!!!!! I can not believe how stupid this problem was.... It turns out the ground wire of the starter relay behind my drivers seat was loose....

 

The old adage, "Check the simple things first" is an old adage for good reason

 

And, this is why I prefaced my checklist with the recommendation ---

 

"Check the simple stuff first. Visually inspect all the electrical connections you can access in the "starting" system ---- battery, starter motor (and solenoid), ignition switch, etc. Check for any loose or corroded connections, and repair them if found."

 

Glad you got it fixed easily (and without spending $$$) !! ....feels good, doesn't it ??

Yeah excellent. I'm confused about this "starter relay" I guess it's under that plastic covered cluster of relays that plug in?

Yeah excellent. I'm confused about this "starter relay" I guess it's under that plastic covered cluster of relays that plug in?

 

If I'm not mistaken (and perhaps, I am?), he is referring to this board located behind the driver's seat. Lamborghini parts manual describes it as "IGNITION RELAY BOX ASSEMBLY" (p/n 0061008765). Looks like it contains several relays and other discrete components, as well as a few multi-pin connector I/F's --- I don't know what they are, because they are listed as NLA individually, although the entire board is still available as a complete assembly. Although, it is called "IGNITION", I would assume that once these devices (and associated relays) are first energized through the ignition circuit, they then supply juice to the starter circuit as well......

 

This is merely an educated guess on my part, so someone please correct me if I'm all wet on this...

If I'm not mistaken (and perhaps, I am?), he is referring to this board located behind the driver's seat. Lamborghini parts manual describes it as "IGNITION RELAY BOX ASSEMBLY" (p/n 0061008765). Looks like it contains several relays and other discrete components, as well as a few multi-pin connector I/F's --- I don't know what they are, because they are listed as NLA individually, although the entire board is still available as a complete assembly. Although, it is called "IGNITION", I would assume that once these devices (and associated relays) are first energized through the ignition circuit, they then supply juice to the starter circuit as well......

 

This is merely an educated guess on my part, so someone please correct me if I'm all wet on this...

 

That's exactly where it was. There ground gound wire for one of those relays that was loose. As soon as he put on correctly the car started right away. I can't believe heat affected this so much. I'm so relived!!!!

I was finally able to stop for gas & the car started right away. lol...

 

Rgds,

Jim