Dow Jones down 870 points

Did Swil make it home? Swilster?

I call complete BS on the silly gossip that's going around on all the news shows about someone having "accidentally typed billion with a 'b' instead of million with an 'm.'"

 

We're talking about trading software and order entering devices. Trades are entered NUMERICALLY! Words are not spelled out as if you were writing prose! This is 2010.

 

They either entered 15,000,000,000 or 15,000,000. VERY hard to believe that adding three extra zeros, especially on a trade that was already that large, is something that would happen by accident.

 

You know I have never been one for conspiracy theories however two weeks ago this took place.

You know what Mr. President? Wall St controls Wall St. Not you, just food for thought!

I said this here, 8 months ago and no one paid attention to me. Some even scoffed at the idea...

 

anybody who feels no market manipulation happens needs to pull there head out of the sand. I don't think it was a mistake.

All it takes is a little push...then they all run to one side of the boat.

 

I don't think there is any institution large enough to actually "manipulate" a market...?

Today was what you call a coordinated assault my man...not one, many.

Today was what you call a coordinated assault my man...not one, many.

 

Who exactly was coordinating the assault?

 

I'm not disagreeing with you; genuinely curious.

 

I like how everytime I order a trade it previews the order and shows totals

 

but the big boys just type M or B and market goes Crrrrraaaazzzy!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Swil, thanks for checking in, was getting worried, will you be shot if you give us a little dirt?

like swil said, once you get it started panic takes over and you hit certain levels it gets worse and worse

what was fucked up, is my dad is a day trader, and was trying to buy and sell while it was going down, and the fcuking system wouldnt let him when shit was hitting the fan. Something was fucked with Schwab today. They told him that there were so many people dumping at one time, that the system froze!

 

you know i use etrade, and ive gotten made fun of for having 9.99 commissions (i now pay 6.99) while other people i knew were paying 4.99 with other brokers, and guess what? etrade worked today...the 90 seconds of chaos etrade never skipped a beat. something similar happend when the markets were selling off in 2008 and td ameritrade and other brokers locked their customers out of their accounts and etrade kept working no problem, i think they even had an advertising campain that said "we still work, come join us" or something

like swil said, once you get it started panic takes over and you hit certain levels it gets worse and worse

 

ive seen this happen every time the FDA declines a drug for a biotech company, they fall like a rock...

 

ITMN went from trading at about 45$ FDA declined their drug and it droped to like $10. ive also seen this when certain trend lines on charts get broken and people start selling (traders who know whatsup) and then peoples stop losses get hit and theres MORE selling, and now people are panicing and their selling, and stocks could drop at insane rates in those conditions if theres no one to buy

I don't think there is any institution large enough to actually "manipulate" a market...?

Instead of looking to who lost money, look at who made big money yesterday. Where did Gold go to yesterday? What big players made money there?

I call complete BS on the silly gossip that's going around on all the news shows about someone having "accidentally typed billion with a 'b' instead of million with an 'm.'"

 

We're talking about trading software

 

Yep, that explanation is laughable, the more likely cause was a glitch in a "blackbox" computer trading program that all the big financial houses use nowadays. These programs run on auto pilot, by using computer algorithms to execute thousands of transactions in seconds, and on any given day they account for 20 to 30% of total trading volume, more than enough to set off a chain reaction like yesterday, if something goes wrong.

 

We will probably never hear the true story, because each house considers their blackbox program "proprietary"... the stock exchanges agree with them and refuse to release trading data that could reveal the algorithms.

mr. vroom the black boxs are probably closer to 50% now

Whatever it is, Jim Cramer has the answer. He knows everything.

 

double post

mr. vroom the black boxs are probably closer to 50% now

 

Wow.... try to imagine the consequences if a terrorist group, rogue state, or criminal enterprise were able to hack into one or more of these programs.

Wow.... try to imagine the consequences if a terrorist group, rogue state, or criminal enterprise were able to hack into one or more of these programs.

depends what you define as terrorist group

Wow.... try to imagine the consequences if a terrorist group, rogue state, or criminal enterprise were able to hack into one or more of these programs.

 

algorithm trading programs are VERY SOPHISTICATED (especially on a BB bank level), having an understanding in computer science + software engineering and an above average in understanding the markets/trading would be in essential... these programs focus on many different technical indicators, black boxes are very complicated

after getting off the phone with a friend of mine from NYC who used to work at the prop desk at GS im going to buy it, basically how he explained it to me is...some BB bank (everyone is pointing the finger at C, so lets say them) accidently sold of a significant amount of shares and that tripped out another banks algorithm and then their program flipped out and started selling, and then individual investors started geting their stop losses hit so their shares are being sold and now the panic investor are dumping their shares, so essentially its a domino effect

I'm not real knowledgeable on markets and trading, but what I want to know is.... what caused a REVERSION in the massive sell-off to regain the 600 pt loss to close -370? Were there automated buy orders when some of the equities dropped? And if so, you'd have to think that most buy orders wouldn't wait until that long to buy some of the quality companies that got hit such as P&G. Also, NASDAQ/NYSE might be canceling some trades, but surely there is significant collateral damage that is not going to be reversed?

 

 

I'm not real knowledgeable on markets and trading, but what I want to know is.... what caused a REVERSION in the massive sell-off to regain the 600 pt loss to close -370? Were there automated buy orders when some of the equities dropped? And if so, you'd have to think that most buy orders wouldn't wait until that long to buy some of the quality companies that got hit such as P&G. Also, NASDAQ/NYSE might be canceling some trades, but surely there is significant collateral damage that is not going to be reversed?

 

The massive sell's were all programed trades. When all of that has exhausted itself and the dust settles everyone left standing starts analyzing things to determine weather or not to jump out the window!

 

Sorry, just the best way I could describe it, lucky I am on the first floor.

What is interesting is how a simple little glitch can often times cause a major financial and then economic calamity. That is what our stupid government needs to keep aware of, just because it looks like the storm passed us by doesn't mean it did. We might be on the verge of another crisis in the near future and all it will take is a small glitch somewhere and KABOOM! For example the Russian debt default in the 1990s caused major havoc, and no one was expecting that (I think it is what brought down LTCM).

 

Another thing to keep in mind is regarding criminal enterprises and rogue states, some of their hackers are very sophisticated. Remember a bunch of big American corporations just recently had the crap hacked out of them without their even realizing it. These "hackers" are teams of very skilled people, where one group might work on one part of the hack and the other group another part, and so forth, it isn't one person.

 

Such a very skilled group I think could come together and maybe hack one of those Wall Street programs.

What is interesting is how a simple little glitch can often times cause a major financial and then economic calamity. That is what our stupid government needs to keep aware of, just because it looks like the storm passed us by doesn't mean it did. We might be on the verge of another crisis in the near future and all it will take is a small glitch somewhere and KABOOM! For example the Russian debt default in the 1990s caused major havoc, and no one was expecting that (I think it is what brought down LTCM).

 

Another thing to keep in mind is regarding criminal enterprises and rogue states, some of their hackers are very sophisticated. Remember a bunch of big American corporations just recently had the crap hacked out of them without their even realizing it. These "hackers" are teams of very skilled people, where one group might work on one part of the hack and the other group another part, and so forth, it isn't one person.

 

Such a very skilled group I think could come together and maybe hack one of those Wall Street programs.

 

Fortunately for us the banks have better groups who make a ridiculous amount of money to keep their systems safe 24/7.

lucky I am on the first floor.

Same here. Markets hopelessly volatile.

markets are technically oversold at this point so i expect to see a bounce on monday, this will be good since it will give people a chance to get puts at a cheaper price. goodluck to you all