Z06 and the Gallardo

How the f#ck did "kit cars" get into this equation. Dude, you're whacked in the brain.

I'm not talking 1/4 mile.  Won't the ZO6 also own at the track??

 

Yes, I think price is directly proportional to performance when were talking about Exotics, or Supercars.  If were talking about luxury cars like a Bently then I think cost is derectly proportional to materials and workmanship and options.

 

Were talking about a Lamborghini.  Just the name invokes thoughts of all out performance.  It looks like the fastest thing on the planet.  It looks like a racecar.  I feel that for the price it should be able to out perform a ZO6.  And, I agree, performace is not about 1//4 mile times.

 

"Own" what at the track? The Gallardo? I doubt it. The new Plastic mess-06 is probably on par with the Gallardo at the track, and that's where I'd leave it. As for the Nurburgring numbers of 7:43 for the Plastic mess-06, the Gallardo has been timed at a similar pace.

 

And if price is directly proportional to performance in the exotic/supercar world, I guess you can't justify the price of an Enzo, CGT or Pagani?

 

Why don't you ask 10 people who can afford a Lambo if they would rather have a Plastic mess-06. What answer do you think you'll get? I love all these POS nut huggers coming to the Lambo sites to say "gee, it's funny how the new Plastic mess-06 can beat a Lambo, huh?". Wow. Better trade up for a POS.

 

Here are a list of cars that the Plastic mess-06 can either outperform, or is on par with in terms of performance:

 

Gallardo

Diablo

F430

360/CS

575

512TR

Ford GT

911 GT2

911 GT3

Esprit Turbo V8

SL55

 

Guess which of those cars I would rather have than a Plastic mess-06? ANY ONE OF THEM.

 

My Point exactly. Of course, I would take any of the cars on that list over a POS. But, there's never been a time when a POS, straight out of the box could beat all of those cars at the track.

 

All I'm saying is that instead of defending the high end manufacturers by saying "I'd rather be seen in a Gallardo than a ZO6" I think their feet should be held to the fire.

 

I brought up "Kit Cars" because they are all about getting the "LOOK" without paying for it. Right? Kit Cars always have Chevy engines and are basically crap. But, some would argue that you do get the "LOOK". All I am saying is that there are folks on this thread saying the same thig as a reason for driving a Lambo over a POS. Like I said, I don't disagree with this concept. But, I also don't agree with giving Lamborghini a pass based on "LOOKS".

 

I think drivers of Porsche, Lambo, Ferrari, etc. should be saying WTF?? Instead of "Oh, that's ok, my car still "LOOKS" better".

I'm not talking 1/4 mile.  Won't the ZO6 also own at the track??

 

Yes, I think price is directly proportional to performance when were talking about Exotics, or Supercars.  If were talking about luxury cars like a Bently then I think cost is derectly proportional to materials and workmanship and options.

 

Were talking about a Lamborghini.  Just the name invokes thoughts of all out performance.  It looks like the fastest thing on the planet.  It looks like a racecar.  I feel that for the price it should be able to out perform a ZO6.  And, I agree, performace is not about 1//4 mile times.

 

"Own" what at the track? The Gallardo? I doubt it. The new Plastic mess-06 is probably on par with the Gallardo at the track, and that's where I'd leave it. As for the Nurburgring numbers of 7:43 for the Plastic mess-06, the Gallardo has been timed at a similar pace.

 

And if price is directly proportional to performance in the exotic/supercar world, I guess you can't justify the price of an Enzo, CGT or Pagani?

 

Why don't you ask 10 people who can afford a Lambo if they would rather have a Plastic mess-06. What answer do you think you'll get? I love all these POS nut huggers coming to the Lambo sites to say "gee, it's funny how the new Plastic mess-06 can beat a Lambo, huh?". Wow. Better trade up for a POS.

 

Here are a list of cars that the Plastic mess-06 can either outperform, or is on par with in terms of performance:

 

Gallardo

Diablo

F430

360/CS

575

512TR

Ford GT

911 GT2

911 GT3

Esprit Turbo V8

SL55

 

Guess which of those cars I would rather have than a Plastic mess-06? ANY ONE OF THEM.

 

I am actually looking for a G-car as we speak, but, lets give credit where it is due.

 

The Plastic mess-06 will beat almost EVERY car on that list with the only car being on par with it is the FGT.

 

As far as the track, the Z should beat every single one of those cars mentioned. The G-car ran a 7:52 at the ring compared to the 7:42.9 for the Plastic mess-06. The Plastic mess-06 also ran a 0-150 in 17.5 secs!! No comparison to any of the above except for the FGT and the Diablo. The rest are history.

 

At the end, i am looking for a G-car right now, and not a Plastic mess-06 for obvious reasons. But that does not take away from what the Plastic mess-06 can do. jmo

I'm not talking 1/4 mile.  Won't the ZO6 also own at the track??

 

Yes, I think price is directly proportional to performance when were talking about Exotics, or Supercars.  If were talking about luxury cars like a Bently then I think cost is derectly proportional to materials and workmanship and options.

 

Were talking about a Lamborghini.  Just the name invokes thoughts of all out performance.  It looks like the fastest thing on the planet.  It looks like a racecar.  I feel that for the price it should be able to out perform a ZO6.  And, I agree, performace is not about 1//4 mile times.

 

"Own" what at the track? The Gallardo? I doubt it. The new Plastic mess-06 is probably on par with the Gallardo at the track, and that's where I'd leave it. As for the Nurburgring numbers of 7:43 for the Plastic mess-06, the Gallardo has been timed at a similar pace.

 

And if price is directly proportional to performance in the exotic/supercar world, I guess you can't justify the price of an Enzo, CGT or Pagani?

 

Why don't you ask 10 people who can afford a Lambo if they would rather have a Plastic mess-06. What answer do you think you'll get? I love all these POS nut huggers coming to the Lambo sites to say "gee, it's funny how the new Plastic mess-06 can beat a Lambo, huh?". Wow. Better trade up for a POS.

 

Here are a list of cars that the Plastic mess-06 can either outperform, or is on par with in terms of performance:

 

Gallardo

Diablo

F430

360/CS

575

512TR

Ford GT

911 GT2

911 GT3

Esprit Turbo V8

SL55

 

Guess which of those cars I would rather have than a Plastic mess-06? ANY ONE OF THEM.

 

I am actually looking for a G-car as we speak, but, lets give credit where it is due.

 

The Plastic mess-06 will beat almost EVERY car on that list with the only car being on par with it is the FGT.

 

As far as the track, the Z should beat every single one of those cars mentioned. The G-car ran a 7:52 at the ring compared to the 7:42.9 for the Plastic mess-06. The Plastic mess-06 also ran a 0-150 in 17.5 secs!! No comparison to any of the above except for the FGT and the Diablo. The rest are history.

 

At the end, i am looking for a G-car right now, and not a Plastic mess-06 for obvious reasons. But that does not take away from what the Plastic mess-06 can do. jmo

 

Round 2-

 

And YOU are BANNED!!! I looked at all 8 of your posts - guess what? 7 of them are about Vettes and giving them credit.

 

Good Bye!

 

-James Miller

Who said anything about "looks" or "being seen"? Have you ever driven ANY of the cars on that list? Have you experienced the "feel" of any of those cars? The noises they make? The way they handle, brake, respond to driver inputs?

 

My guess is that you have not driven a single car on that list. Until then, you just won't get it.

Who said anything about "looks" or "being seen"?  Have you ever driven ANY of the cars on that list?  Have you experienced the "feel" of any of those cars?  The noises they make?  The way they handle, brake, respond to driver inputs?  

 

My guess is that you have not driven a single car on that list.  Until then, you just won't get it.

 

Well then, your guess would be wrong.

 

Dude, I am agreeing with you. I would rather have any of those cars over a POS. In the past you could say a POS was a P.O.S. because it was. But now, it's gonna beat all of those cars at the track. You can still call it a P.O.S. but I think there is less justification now.

 

I am only saying that I think the High End Car manufacturers are getting a free pass from most owners on this issue when they should be saying "WTF"??

By the way, to clarify something for the lap time junkies and sharkface boy:

 

The 7:52 time for the Gallardo at Nuburgring was acheived in 2003 by Sport Auto Magazine test drivers. For some reason, this number has stuck with the car, despite the fact that REAL test drivers have attained faster lap times.

 

The 7:43 acheived by the Plastic mess-06 was with GM Factory test drivers (Le Mans Race Car drivers).

 

Gee, who do you think would be faster around a track...a Le Mans Driver or some schmuck from Sport Auto Magazine? Hmmm...that's a tough one.

 

Also, the Murcielago has 2 posted "official" times for the Ring, at 7:50 and 7:43. Oh my good gosh, how is that possible? Any Joe Blow from the street corner should be able to make the Murcielago boogie around a track at the same rate as a factory Le Mans driver, right?

 

Get the picture?

Well then, your guess would be wrong.

 

Really? Care to elaborate?

By the way, to clarify something for the lap time junkies and sharkface boy:

 

The 7:52 time for the Gallardo at Nuburgring was acheived in 2003 by Sport Auto Magazine test drivers.  For some reason, this number has stuck with the car, despite the fact that REAL test drivers have attained faster lap times.

 

The 7:43 acheived by the Plastic mess-06 was with GM Factory test drivers (Le Mans Race Car drivers).

 

Gee, who do you think would be faster around a track...a Le Mans Driver or some schmuck from Sport Auto Magazine?  Hmmm...that's a tough one.

 

Also, the Murcielago has 2 posted "official" times for the Ring, at 7:50 and 7:43.  Oh my good gosh, how is that possible?  Any Joe Blow from the street corner should be able to make the Murcielago boogie around a track at the same rate as a factory Le Mans driver, right?  

 

Get the picture?

 

I agree that a Professional driver will have a better time. No Doubt.

 

Why hasn't the same driver raced both cars yet?? Or do you think that is to come? IMHO, if the same driver drives a Gallardo, Murcielago and a ZO6, the lambos should smoke the ZO6 by a large margin. If all cars come across with the same times I think some changes need to be made at Lambo. I think it's time for the high end guys to step it up a level. Especially considering they have more money to work with.

 

Do you not agree?

In the past you could say a POS was a P.O.S. because it was.  But now, it's gonna beat all of those cars at the track.  You can still call it a P.O.S. but I think there is less justification now.

 

Still NOT getting it are YOU?

 

-James Miller

IMHO, if the same driver drives a Gallardo, Murcielago and a ZO6, the lambos should smoke the ZO6 by a large margin.

 

Are you bi-polar, or are you able to talk out of your mouth AND your ass? Just a second ago you were saying the Plastic mess-06 smokes anything that doesn't have a jet engine. Now you swing the other way?

 

What cars on that list have you driven again? :roll:

In your opinion if the same driver drives the Lambo's and the Plastic mess-06, the Lambo's will leave the Plastic mess-06 in the dust?  

 

Are you bi-polar, or are you able to talk out of your mouth AND your ass?  Just a second ago you were saying the Plastic mess-06 smokes anything that doesn't have a jet engine.  Now you swing the other way?  

 

What cars on that list have you driven again?

 

Clax,

 

Why are you so emotional? Am I calling you names?

 

I thought we were having a philosphical discusion.

 

I'm not talking out of both sides of my mouth. I am relaying information that has already been stated by yourself and others on this thread. You stated the lap times between the Gallardo and the ZO6. Are you reading all the way through my posts? I don't know which car is faster. Based on what others have said it this thread it seems the consensus is that the ZO6 is faster.

 

I am saying that if it is faster I think the exotics need to step up a level. That's all.

 

Take a chill pill!

If all cars come across with the same times I think some changes need to be made at Lambo.  I think it's time for the high end guys to step it up a level.  Especially considering they have more money to work with.

 

First of all, changes are being made at every car manufacturer, in every segment of the market, every day of the year. That's how cars get built and continuously improved. The new 06 Gallardo has shorter gearing, 20 more horsepower and updated steering. The 07 Murci will have a larger displacement engine expected to have another 50-60 horsepower than the current model year.

 

Second of all, NO, the "high end guys" don't have more money to work with. More money than GM? I don't think so.

 

You seem to have a really weak grasp of all things automotive. And I'm still eagerly awaiting for you to tell us all about your driving experiences with the list of exotics.

If all cars come across with the same times I think some changes need to be made at Lambo.  I think it's time for the high end guys to step it up a level.  Especially considering they have more money to work with.

 

First of all, changes are being made at every car manufacturer, in every segment of the market, every day of the year. That's how cars get built and continuously improved. The new 06 Gallardo has shorter gearing, 20 more horsepower and updated steering. The 07 Murci will have a larger displacement engine expected to have another 50-60 horsepower than the current model year.

 

Second of all, NO, the "high end guys" don't have more money to work with. More money than GM? I don't think so.

 

You seem to have a really weak grasp of all things automotive. And I'm still eagerly awaiting for you to tell us all about your driving experiences with the list of exotics.

 

Clax,

 

Once again, did you read my last post?

 

I own a manufacturing company. I know how manufacturing works. I know how R and D works. I think it's great that Lambo is making these changes.

 

As for the "High End" guys don't have money. I have to disagree. GM is in the red. Mercedes doesn't have the money? Audi doesn't have the money? Ferrari doesn't have the money?

 

You are saying the reason the ZO6 may be faster is that Lambo doesn't have the money to build a faster car? With this statement aren't you making your own point moot?

 

As for my car experience here we go. I have owned:

 

355

360

SL55

Sl500

S55

Viper

A8L Audi (now)

 

I am on the list for Audi LeMans which right now is built on the Gallardo frame. If it doesn't get here soon I will just get a Gallardo.

 

I have driven:

 

F40

ZO6 (old one)

Gallardo

911TT

Countach

Diablo

 

Hell.. a lot of cars. I don't know.

 

My apprehension with going with another exotic is things like the ZO6. I feel like the exotics need to take it to the next level. If not in terms of performance then definitely in terms of serviceability, warranty, service, etc. I know Lambo is doing a very good job with this already.

 

I'm not going to get a ZO6. But I think it's pretty cool what they are doing with it. I don't feel it should just be written off the ay it has been in the past.

The POS has bugged us for over fifty years, yet in Nobles five year old existence they have already made a car that is faster at the same price. My point? Making a fast car is not especially expensive, and not very difficult. There are several examples of that, e.g. Noble and Ariel.

 

A mass produced car with cheap interior and dull design doesn't appeal to me at all, even if it's twice as fast as a lambo. The POS lacks rareness, style, charisma, soul and image. And the value drops like a rock.

The POS has bugged us for over fifty years, yet in Nobles five year old existence they have already made a car that is faster at the same price. My point? Making a fast car is not especially expensive, and not very difficult. There are several examples of that, e.g. Noble and Ariel.

 

A mass produced car with cheap interior and dull design doesn't appeal to me at all, even if it's twice as fast as a lambo. The POS lacks rareness, style, charisma, soul and image. And the value drops like a rock.

 

I'm not sure Noble and Ariel are good examples. Why are you taking the stance that making a fast car is not expensive?? How much do F1 cars cost to build?

 

I have owned a lot of cars. You know what? I've never made money on any of them. They all drop like rocks.

 

If you want to get into Enzo, McLaren, F40 territory you are talking a whole different animal compared to a Gallardo. Those are collector cars and you probably will make money on them.

I'm not sure Noble and Ariel are good examples.  Why are you taking the stance that making a fast car is not expensive??  How much do F1 cars cost to build?

 

I have owned a lot of cars.  You know what?  I've never made money on any of them.  They all drop like rocks.  

 

If you want to get into Enzo, McLaren, F40 territory you are talking a whole different animal compared to a Gallardo.  Those are collector cars and you probably will make money on them.

 

I'm not sure what F1 cars have to do with this. They have nothing to do with street legal cars at all. I think Noble and Ariel are great examples. They are literally new born in the auto-world, and make relatively cheap cars that will outperform just about any other production car. And still looks better than most of them. Ok, the Ariel may not look like a car

 

As for the value of cars, the less that is made of them, the slower they fall in value (of course). I’m not saying you will make money on a G (you won’t), but a POS will drop a lot faster (compared to the initial value).

If you have in fact owned all those cars, and driven the other cars, I'm not quite sure why you are concerned that the "high end" manufacturers need to make changes immediately. The market will dictate where changes are necessary. If people owning Lambo's and Ferrari's start selling their cars to buy Plastic mess-06's, then the exotic manufacturers need to worry. But, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that's not going to happen. Owning an exotic car isn't about "bragging rights". That sh#t is for 18 year olds with hopped up ricers. Owning an exotic car is about the overall experience that it delivers. If you have a concern that there is a "faster car out there for less money", then the problem isn't the car...

I'm not sure Noble and Ariel are good examples.  Why are you taking the stance that making a fast car is not expensive??  How much do F1 cars cost to build?

 

I have owned a lot of cars.  You know what?  I've never made money on any of them.  They all drop like rocks.  

 

If you want to get into Enzo, McLaren, F40 territory you are talking a whole different animal compared to a Gallardo.  Those are collector cars and you probably will make money on them.

 

I'm not sure what F1 cars have to do with this. They have nothing to do with street legal cars at all. I think Noble and Ariel are great examples. They are literally new born in the auto-world, and make relatively cheap cars that will outperform just about any other production car. And still looks better than most of them. Ok, the Ariel may not look like a car

 

As for the value of cars, the less that is made of them, the slower they fall in value (of course). I’m not saying you will make money on a G (you won’t), but a POS will drop a lot faster (compared to the initial value).

 

OK then, let's take the Noble as an example. I would drive one over a POS but I still wouldn't drive one. But if a noble can accomplish what you are saying for so much less than a G then don't you think Lambo needs to step it up?

 

As for losing value. If a POS only costs me $65,000.00 and I end up selling it for $45,000.00 the I lost $20K. Do I not stand to lose the same amount or more with a G car considering it costs so much more?

OK then, let's take the Noble as an example.  I would drive one over a POS but I still wouldn't drive one.  But if a noble can accomplish what you are saying for so much less than a G then don't you think Lambo needs to step it up?

 

Not this again. Wake up. He was illustrating that there are other cars out there, other than the Plastic mess-06, that fall into the flat-out-performance category. So what.

 

As far as stepping up, Lambo, Ferrari, Porsche, etc, etc are stepping up every day. You seem to have some problem driving an exotic car when there may be another car out there that is slightly faster than yours. That's just sad. I would recommed a visit to Stuart Smalley or Dr. Phil to sort out your issues. Or, just go buy a Plastic mess-06 and a Lambo so you can cover all your bases of insecurity.

If you have in fact owned all those cars, and driven the other cars, I'm not quite sure why you are concerned that the "high end" manufacturers need to make changes immediately.  The market will dictate where changes are necessary.  If people owning Lambo's and Ferrari's start selling their cars to buy Plastic mess-06's, then the exotic manufacturers need to worry.  But, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that's not going to happen.  Owning an exotic car isn't about "bragging rights".  That sh#t is for 18 year olds with hopped up ricers.  Owning an exotic car is about the overall experience that it delivers.  If you have a concern that there is a "faster car out there for less money", then the problem isn't the car...

 

I agree that the market will dictate. That's what free market economy is all about. Therefore, I disagree with you that the ZO6 will have no effect on Lambo, Ferrari and Porsche sales. I have read of a lot of people waiting to buy until the Plastic mess-06 comes out. I may be wrong. You know what they say about statistics.

 

Granted, Covette has always been there, but I have never seen so much hype given to a POS as a "Supercar" as there is with this new Plastic mess-06. I wll never buy a Plastic mess-06, but I can't say that it's hype hasn't slowed me from getting into another exotic. It has. There are articles on it everywhere. I think it will push the exotics to new levels.

 

This is what has pushed me into going with the Lemans (When it ever comes out) for right now. Afterall, it's just an Audi. I'll probably save my exotic money and go for something more collectible in the future.

if it bugs u that much, u CAN put NO2 in, i wouldnt; but its an option..taht way when the ego is bruised u can heal it quickly without expensive mods..maybe thats for u..?

OK then, let's take the Noble as an example.  I would drive one over a POS but I still wouldn't drive one.  But if a noble can accomplish what you are saying for so much less than a G then don't you think Lambo needs to step it up?

 

Not this again. Wake up. He was illustrating that there are other cars out there, other than the Plastic mess-06, that fall into the flat-out-performance category. So what.

 

As far as stepping up, Lambo, Ferrari, Porsche, etc, etc are stepping up every day. You seem to have some problem driving an exotic car when there may be another car out there that is slightly faster than yours. That's just sad. I would recommed a visit to Stuart Smalley or Dr. Phil to sort out your issues. Or, just go buy a Plastic mess-06 and a Lambo so you can cover all your bases of insecurity.

 

So you don't feel that Lamoborghini is in the performance category?

...

...

 

OK,

 

You guys win. I just wanted to talk about it. I think it's interesting.

 

Sorry.