Aventador...... The Truth

This is how Roy had described it on another board:

"Part of the CAFE rules "Required" the secondary "cats" in-corperated with the muffler enclouser, they no longer are seperate, put act as a whole one piece unit with the exhaust "restrictive" sound control muffler system. They are further completely tied into the ECU and the engine managment system. They are even furthered "guarded" from removal by the management system, with them out they will immediately cause a fault and a non running motor.

 

I am sure there will be a way and some one that will come up with it, but then again maybe not due to the cost it will take and the research...one thing for sure, it wont be cheap..and I am sure it will have issues at strict emission control sites at registration time in most States."

 

 

That is sad news, its no where near as loud as the stock ferraris and if you cant put an exhaust on it it will be a real loss to the car.

Had some up close pics of mine of the engine out, doesn't look like the muffler has many connections except vacuum lines when added, it all seems to be before that, although hard to tell.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It doesn't matter how over it they are. Lamborghini will not warranty the motor if there is any modification to the exhaust and this time I think they can make that stick.

It doesn't matter how over it they are. Lamborghini will not warranty the motor if there is any modification to the exhaust and this time I think they can make that stick.

 

 

Interesting stuff and its a real shame they don't offer their own sports exhaust like they put on the race cars, it doesnt seem to do them any harm. As stated that cannot apply in Europe, European law protects the consumers right to choice and so manufacturers cannot hold people to ransom on such things, especially parts, which is enshrined in law, assuming the replacement part is of equal quality (tuv certificate may be required) then they would have to honour the warranty, the same applies to servicing, it can be serviced anywhere so long as it is done in accordance with the manufacturers schedule and the warranty would remain intact.

 

It may be different in other countries.

Interesting stuff and its a real shame they don't offer their own sports exhaust like they put on the race cars, it doesnt seem to do them any harm. As stated that cannot apply in Europe, European law protects the consumers right to choice and so manufacturers cannot hold people to ransom on such things, especially parts, which is enshrined in law, assuming the replacement part is of equal quality (tuv certificate may be required) then they would have to honour the warranty, the same applies to servicing, it can be serviced anywhere so long as it is done in accordance with the manufacturers schedule and the warranty would remain intact.

 

It may be different in other countries.

 

I still then the bar is fairly high in the US too, but I don't think this will be as simple as the after market exhaust for other models. Also for those considering making mods, there is point where it's just not worth the return on investment either. I had the OC exhaust on my LP640 and I loved it. I have the factory exhaust on my SV and I'm still happy even though it's not that loud at idle. It comes alive at speed enough to make me happy.

 

The cabin in the Aventador is far quieter than any Murcielago and that's not all bad. It does make it easier to carry on a conversation without taking a giant breath or leaning in to hear what the passenger is saying.

 

 

 

It's worth it when people start turboing these. Actually, sounds pretty easy to bypass. They said the GT-R was completely untunable, look where it is now. Not sure about emissions for a vehicle like this though. How often do you need to it? Could you just pass with the stock exhaust and change it out afterwards?

The car sounds nice stock just listen to the topgear video. Wont say it couldnt be improved with a tubi

 

From the pics of the muffler system i dont see any new components that would throw a limp mode code. Other than the exhaust 02 sensor and the exhaust valve solenoid i doubt there is anything else. Both of these could be dealt with without throwing a code as it has been done in the past by several aftermarket exhaust manufacturers.

 

You also have several ways of changing the sound of the car without having to get rid of that huge muffler.

 

1) Unplug the valves to make them always open, the car will sound much louder both idling and throughout the rev range. (easiest solution i believe)

 

2) Exchange the cats for high flow ones ( straight cats might throw a code)

 

3) Just get rid of that muffler and throw in some straight pipes

 

 

The car sounds nice stock just listen to the topgear video. Wont say it couldnt be improved with a tubi

 

From the pics of the muffler system i dont see any new components that would throw a limp mode code. Other than the exhaust 02 sensor and the exhaust valve solenoid i doubt there is anything else. Both of these could be dealt with without throwing a code as it has been done in the past by several aftermarket exhaust manufacturers.

 

You also have several ways of changing the sound of the car without having to get rid of that huge muffler.

 

1) Unplug the valves to make them always open, the car will sound much louder both idling and throughout the rev range. (easiest solution i believe)

 

2) Exchange the cats for high flow ones ( straight cats might throw a code)

 

3) Just get rid of that muffler and throw in some straight pipes

 

 

I was told by a Lamborghini mechanic that the muffler system not only incorporates the secondary cats, it has pre-pressure as well os post-pressure sensors that will send the car into limp mode at the slightest variance. So, tuners are going to need to get into that ECU (which can compute 500 million computations per second) and change some code around. Some of the tuners will probably invest the time to do this but it will definitely void the warranty.

as every car in the world (ODB or not OBD) you can change the muffler and install an open exhaust.

 

The important thing is to keep the O2 sensors. Without the 02 sensores you have to install a decoy device to send the correct voltage to the ECU that replace the sensor voltage: a bit difficult but not impossible at all.

 

Better keep the 02 sensors because they help the engine to work well.

 

 

Ciao

 

I was told by a Lamborghini mechanic that the muffler system not only incorporates the secondary cats, it has pre-pressure as well os post-pressure sensors that will send the car into limp mode at the slightest variance. So, tuners are going to need to get into that ECU (which can compute 500 million computations per second) and change some code around. Some of the tuners will probably invest the time to do this but it will definitely void the warranty.

 

 

Hmm interesting, i wont believe it till i see it though. Even if it really has pressure sensors im sure tricking them wont be a problem.

 

I noticed you you have an aventador on order, congrats! Iv got the exact same combo on order. Did you get any delivery date?

Hmm interesting, i wont believe it till i see it though. Even if it really has pressure sensors im sure tricking them wont be a problem.

 

 

contrats to you both for the car choice

 

ciao

I don't know about that.

 

 

I got a couple minutes in the car and my initial impressions were changed. I was able to adjust the seat for a better fit and while impressed, I can say the opinions that the car "lacks soul" are not far off. Yes, it's fast, yest it's nice, yes its Audi. I like the new shift interface on the dash. I wish the start button cover was aluminum, the plastic felt cheap.

 

Technologically impressive and fast, it lacks the character of say the Countach or Diablo.

 

Time will tell, and I hope the SV version, or roadster will help bring it more to life.

 

My image of an LFA driver so far is an inexperienced exotic owner. That will change over time, but I've read some of their posts about their expectations about ownership and I slap my forehead in disbelief. I know of very few owned by guys who have extensive exotic experience. Most LFA buyers are completely new to exotics and the few I've spoken with have misconceptions about exotic ownership so who knows if they will sustain their love for the car. The age demographic seems to be older than the Italian stuff.

 

Tommy,

Appreciate the extensive write up... I just wanted to see if you wouldn't mind elaborating a little bit more on the paragraph i've quoted you on, particularly the "I've read some of their posts about their expectations about ownership and I slap my forehead in disbelief." As a marketing and car guy, I really find this type of stuff interesting and sometimes entertaining ... Thanks in advance if you get a minute.

-cp

Tommy,

Appreciate the extensive write up... I just wanted to see if you wouldn't mind elaborating a little bit more on the paragraph i've quoted you on, particularly the "I've read some of their posts about their expectations about ownership and I slap my forehead in disbelief." As a marketing and car guy, I really find this type of stuff interesting and sometimes entertaining ... Thanks in advance if you get a minute.

-cp

 

Generally these new owners don't think about considerations that come from experience- and admittedly I went through it too, where you can't just take an exotic anywhere and just treat it as you would a daily driver. They also don't take into account the sudden competition the LFA faces with zero mile cars that are titled by dealer-owners who don't drive them while they themselves are racking up miles, thinking they will drive it just anywhere like a daily driver only to then learn that they will pay a huge premium for those miles, more so than any Lamborghini. It would be different if the 172 US vehicles were all owned by end customers, but this is not the case. If you look at Cars.com and do a general search, you will already see that seven of the roughly forty LFAs brought to the US are already for sale by dealers. According to Lexus, those cars had to be titled (don't know if this is really the case) but assuming so, are you really going to be driving your LFA to the store to pick up that loaf of bread you forgot?

 

Another point of naivety is when they argue that Lexus history of reliability will translate, one for one, with the LFA. They don't seem to understand that Lexus achieved that by putting a lot of the same model cars on the road, spreading R&D over a wider test bed. I've tried to explain that even if the LFA had better reliability, how much of a difference does it really make when you're not putting all that many miles on the cars anyway? Then assume you are racking up the miles, can you imagine the GIANT depreciation hit when so many cars are not getting any miles on them at all? How in the world does that make the LFA cost less per mile simply because it's expected to be more reliable?

 

Misconceptions about exotic ownership are common, but what's unique about the LFA is that most of the buyers are not coming out of mainstream exotic ownership anyway. The few that are on the forums have no prior exotic ownership of any kind and assume they will just drive through the same cars wash, drive the same roads, leave it in the same grocery store lot, eat at the same restaurants, etc., and still suffer less depreciation simply because of reliability than Lamborghini or Ferrari or even Porsche.

 

Last, they don't seem to realize that once all 172 cars are on the road, the market niche will disappear from Lexus all together so there won't be the usual brand building that goes with a continuation of product and the LFA will quickly drift out of top-of-the-mind awareness forever. It's not going to be worth more than they paid and all indicators are so far that values will drop through the floor unless Lexus steps up and tried to retain a culture behind the LFA, something they don't seem to be considering at the moment.

 

I sill think the LFA is a terrific car and one that should get lots of respect. I just think buyers have to be well aware of what they are buying and be comfortable with the idea that they are buying a brand orphan that so far seems to have a soft demand and there is zero evidence to support that these cars will somehow go up in value. It's a wonderful car to drive, it's fit and finish is outstanding, and there are lots of dealers to support it, but it's absolutely no panacea as some LFA buyers seem to think.