LP560 owners...E-gear system

So tonight I actually got some time to myself and took out the 560 to try and really get to know the car. I went out on a drive with some friends and I tried out Corsa mode as well as some other modes.

 

In Corsa mode, is it normal for the tranny to shift so abruptly that on each and every shift (2-3, 3-4, 4-5) the tranny feels like it is just going to break? Not only does my whole body shift on each gear change, but I literally feel the gear change and it is violent! This abrupt gear change intensifies when I shift the car at a higher RPM. At a lower RPM, it is much more tolerable.

 

I am trying to understand if this is a normal characteristic of the 560 gearbox and I am just spoiled by the GTR's DCT, or if there is something actually wrong and I need a software update or something of that sort.

 

Any and all opinions would be appreciated. Thanks.

So tonight I actually got some time to myself and took out the 560 to try and really get to know the car. I went out on a drive with some friends and I tried out Corsa mode as well as some other modes.

 

In Corsa mode, is it normal for the tranny to shift so abruptly that on each and every shift (2-3, 3-4, 4-5) the tranny feels like it is just going to break? Not only does my whole body shift on each gear change, but I literally feel the gear change and it is violent! This abrupt gear change intensifies when I shift the car at a higher RPM. At a lower RPM, it is much more tolerable.

 

I am trying to understand if this is a normal characteristic of the 560 gearbox and I am just spoiled by the GTR's DCT, or if there is something actually wrong and I need a software update or something of that sort.

 

Any and all opinions would be appreciated. Thanks.

It's normal!!

Very normal.

 

And believe it or not the LP700 in Corsa is even more violent...

 

Lambo calls this a "feature" of the car, that's what all our massive debate wars were about last year when we found out they were skipping DCT for the LP700.

 

It really is personal preference, some owners love it and are now a bit bored with the sedate DCT boxes in F-cars and Porsches, while others don't enjoy taking a baseball bat to the back of their head with every pull of the paddle. :lol2:

Its normal and the lp700 is definitely more violent. I think its cool. If you don't like it, just leave the car in sport instead of corsa.

It's normal!!

 

 

Very normal.

 

And believe it or not the LP700 in Corsa is even more violent...

 

Lambo calls this a "feature" of the car, that's what all our massive debate wars were about last year when we found out they were skipping DCT for the LP700.

 

It really is personal preference, some owners love it and are now a bit bored with the sedate DCT boxes in F-cars and Porsches, while others don't enjoy taking a baseball bat to the back of their head with every pull of the paddle. :lol2:

 

Its normal and the lp700 is definitely more violent. I think its cool. If you don't like it, just leave the car in sport instead of corsa.

 

 

Thanks fellas.

 

So these teeth shattering gear changes are what the fuss was all about in the earlier debate of DCT vs. single clutch. Now I get it all and will concur with the ones that said a single clutch is 'old technology' and don't prefer it. I understand the logic behind wanting a 'in your face' gearbox to match the car's personality, but I feel there is a line that shouldn't be crossed with how abrupt a gear change actually is, and Lambo didn't just cross the line, they ran it over...

 

I only tried corsa mode last night on a WOT run. Tonight I will try a WOT run in sport mode and hope to feel a difference that's more soothing to my cranium.

 

EDIT: In talking with VBOXKING, he told me that the previous debate was regarding the single clutch jerky characteristics of stop and go driving. I just want to express my opinions about this particular aspect and say that i am VERY impressed with this e-gear in stop and go traffic. Actually, I would go as far and say that it is just as smooth as the DCT. It is obviously slower, but as far as smoothness, it definitely is.

Man that is the beauty of Lambo, raw and in your face!!! I took my buddy for a spin and when the gear changes kicked in, all he had to say was holy sh*t!!!!!

 

I absolutely love it, would love to sit in an aventador and feel the changes.

 

Lambo CEO has vowed to never go down the DCT route, because of feel and weight savings that the single clutch provides.

Thanks fellas.

 

So these teeth shattering gear changes are what the fuss was all about in the earlier debate of DCT vs. single clutch. Now I get it all and will concur with the ones that said a single clutch is 'old technology' and don't prefer it. I understand the logic behind wanting a 'in your face' gearbox to match the car's personality, but I feel there is a line that shouldn't be crossed with how abrupt a gear change actually is, and Lambo didn't just cross the line, they ran it over...

 

I only tried corsa mode last night on a WOT run. Tonight I will try a WOT run in sport mode and hope to feel a difference that's more soothing to my cranium.

 

EDIT: In talking with VBOXKING, he told me that the previous debate was regarding the single clutch jerky characteristics of stop and go driving. I just want to express my opinions about this particular aspect and say that i am VERY impressed with this e-gear in stop and go traffic. Actually, I would go as far and say that it is just as smooth as the DCT. It is obviously slower, but as far as smoothness, it definitely is.

 

 

It started when Lambo's R/D lead said in an interview that they could have gone with a DCT transmission for the LP700 but that they chose not to because their customers wanted a more "emotional" experience from their Lambo than the benign way a DCT unit operates, along with the lower weight of the single clutch unit being more desireable.

 

That set off a firestorm of back and forth on the board between those who believe Lambo/Audi were simply pinching pennies with the LP700 and outright lying about the real reason they didn't opt for developing a DCT for it, versus those who took Lambo's comments at face value and agreed with the direction of the company in terms of the single-clutch units providing a superior emotional impact for the driver (as evidenced by Aaron's preference for it, and others who have vocally come to its defense after taking delivery).

 

In the end it's personal preference, some really love it while other owners never put the car in Corsa at all because of it.

 

I will tell you this though: It's been documented previously on the board that when the cars are in Corsa mode they tend to get a longer lifespan out of their clutches.

 

There's no exact number for it since there's so much environmentally that can affect that lifespan (driving habits, traffic stop and go commutes, etc) but if you have two equal cars with equal environments and one runs in Sport all it's life while the other runs in Corsa, typically the Corsa car will need fewer new clutches over the course of its life. Food for thought.

 

Bottom line: Be a MAN Fadi, and drive it in Corsa!!

I will tell you this though: It's been documented previously on the board that when the cars are in Corsa mode they tend to get a longer lifespan out of their clutches.

 

Sure, makes sense since there is less clutch slip going on.

 

Unfortunately, I don't agree with Lambos philosophy of 'emotional' connection. IMO, this gearbox mechanisim (in corsa mode) reduces the fun and ultimately pushes me away from driving the car as much as I originaly intended to. Sure, Lambo doesn't give a shit about what I think, but I have the feeling that most Lambo owners outside of this forum (since we all know we are an owner population on the miniture scale) may feel the same way. I believe that the 'emotional' connection is already there just from the acquisition alone, and I feel that the drive should compliment the ownership experience, that being - awesome and rewarding. There is nothing awesome or rewarding about having your teeth kicked in everytime you shift the car, lol.

 

BTW Mako, I completely understand what you said. I am just sharing MY OPINION with you, which you of course may or may not agree with. I am also fully aware that there are other modes in the car available to me that will not leave me feeling this way, but unfortunately there are sacrifices and benefits I don't get when in other modes (like shift speed and exhaust noise, which are more pronounced in Corsa vs. "normal" mode)

 

And lastly, have you ever driven a 560 in Corsa, Mako? If so, what is YOUR opinion? Do you personaly agree with Lambos philosophy after driving it? If you haven't driven it, GO DRIVE ONE as I would be very curious to see what you think about it.

I've ridden in a 560 in Corsa mode, but never driven one. Personally I go back and forth on this "emotion" issue, though I can see why others love it...

 

The whiplash effect is sometimes fun as hell and many probably get to enjoy the brutality of it a little (especially when trying to surprise friends on joyrides no doubt, lol), but when I've experienced any of these cars in Corsa I feel that the abruptness is offputting.

 

For example, most of us know you're not suppossed to downshift during a turn. Not in F1, not in karting, not anywhere. You're suppossed to have your braking and exit gear selection completed BEFORE you turn the wheel.

 

But that's not realistic for those us not named "Schumacher" and what happens if you pull that downshift paddle mid-turn at the max g-threshold?

 

It's a chassis disruption that is butt-puckering for sure, and while I'm not saying that it can't be done I am saying that it's offputting, scary even, at speed.

 

In a straight line though when you're alone in the car, it can surely make the entire experience more visceral, more in touch with the car a bit, versus the more smooth DCT systems that are far more "video gameish" in their execution.

 

I go back and forth on it honestly, but in my case I'm far from being in a car that forces an automated clutch option (like the 560, where 6-speed cars are rediculously rare). In my price bracket I can opt for a used 2006 Gallardo where manual cars are more plentiful, and not have to worry about this entire problem thankfully.

 

I used to think that traffic and convenience would sway me more towards the automated options, but I now feel that I want one more car with a true manual transmission before progress ultimately 'forces' it out the door (newer models with no manual option).

 

For you Fadi, you need to get used to it. Drive it more and you may find you love it and miss the drama when in more sedate-shifting cars...we've heard that before from several members.

I've ridden in a 560 in Corsa mode, but never driven one. Personally I go back and forth on this "emotion" issue, though I can see why others love it...

 

The whiplash effect is sometimes fun as hell and many probably get to enjoy the brutality of it a little (especially when trying to surprise friends on joyrides no doubt, lol), but when I've experienced any of these cars in Corsa I feel that the abruptness is offputting.

 

For example, most of us know you're not suppossed to downshift during a turn. Not in F1, not in karting, not anywhere. You're suppossed to have your braking and exit gear selection completed BEFORE you turn the wheel.

 

But that's not realistic for those us not named "Schumacher" and what happens if you pull that downshift paddle mid-turn at the max g-threshold?

 

It's a chassis disruption that is butt-puckering for sure, and while I'm not saying that it can't be done I am saying that it's offputting, scary even, at speed.

 

In a straight line though when you're alone in the car, it can surely make the entire experience more visceral, more in touch with the car a bit, versus the more smooth DCT systems that are far more "video gameish" in their execution.

 

I go back and forth on it honestly, but in my case I'm far from being in a car that forces an automated clutch option (like the 560, where 6-speed cars are rediculously rare). In my price bracket I can opt for a used 2006 Gallardo where manual cars are more plentiful, and not have to worry about this entire problem thankfully.

 

I used to think that traffic and convenience would sway me more towards the automated options, but I now feel that I want one more car with a true manual transmission before progress ultimately 'forces' it out the door (newer models with no manual option).

 

For you Fadi, you need to get used to it. Drive it more and you may find you love it and miss the drama when in more sedate-shifting cars...we've heard that before from several members.

 

Make no mistake Mako, the 560 gearbox in stop and go traffic is great and very friendly. As I mentioned before, I am thoroughly surprised that a single clutch gearbox can be this smooth. I am very happy with it in that aspect. My only gripe is strictly the Corsa mode in spirited driving. I don't know if I will ever accept the shifting mechanisim even with more miles. It seems like this characteristic of the 560 is a love it or hate it relationship and depends on the personality of the individual.

 

On a side note, I drove the car in Sport mode all evening today and I like it MUCH better..=)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just an FYI alert...

 

Carol (i.e. "cake") drives HER balloon white E-Gear 560 with Callistos in CORSA mode all day, every day.

 

Just an FYI...

I could not stand my 560 in any mode except Corsa during daily driving. All other modes felt sluggish. I would go out of my way to shift at WOT in Corsa, and also go hot into the brakes to hear the bark of the rev match. Can't believe you don't love the upshifts in Corsa, Kisco. They are great fun, even moreso in tunnels.

Man, there must be something you guys are experiencing that I am just not in Corsa mode. Please explain to me, what/where is the fun in shifting and feeling/hearing the mechanics of the gearbox changing gears in a very abrupt manner?? I am not buying the 'emotional connection' philosophy. There is simply nothing rewarding about shifting the car and immediately after wondering if your tranny is still in once piece or if it's in several pieces scattered on the highway.

 

I agree that the modes outside of Corsa feel a little slow in comparison, but I would much rather feel a relatively slower, smoother shift in sport mode than a little faster, very abrupt shift in Corsa mode.

 

Maybe as I am aging my testosterone levels are starting to decrease, or maybe the lack of sex from my wife due to the recent newborn is causing some hormonal imbalance in my body, IDK, but what I do know is that I hate Corsa mode..

This exact reason is why I canceled my 458 order. The DCT was so lifeless IMO, it felt like something was missing, I missed the violence of my 560 and thus will continue to wait patiently for the G replacement...and hope it doesn't go DCT.

 

LONG LIVE CORSA!!

This exact reason is why I canceled my 458 order. The DCT was so lifeless IMO, it felt like something was missing, I missed the violence of my 560 and thus will continue to wait patiently for the G replacement...and hope it doesn't go DCT.

 

LONG LIVE CORSA!!

 

I've done 8200 miles as of today in my 2011 LP, which was my first sports car that wasn't a manual. After a load of thought i went for it as i know that if i want a manual i'll want it in something older and lighter than the current sports cars; the new super cars are all so fast that even with a manual i don't think you'll actually have that much more interaction and fun than with the e-gear / F1/ DCT set-ups now available. My next car (before the Aventador roadster) will be an older Porsche of some kind in a manual guise.

 

In regards to my ownership experience, i've had the car since June 11' and taken it from London to the South of France, which involved 14 hours straight driving, loads of day trips etc. Until recently i've driven the car in Sport mode 90% of the time, even when it was snowing. About 6 weeks ago i was sitting in heavy traffic and i was getting a little annoyed with the car in sport mode thinking that it was being clunky and needed to go in for a re-callibration when i decided to put it into standard mode (non-automatic). I also don't like the way it goes from sport into neutral if you're coming off the accelerator as it can be too sharp if you don't hit it in the right spot. The car in traffic is extremely compliant in the standard mode and is actually now my preference on my morning commute. On my way home each night it goes into Sport as at 8pm on avg. there's little to no traffic. Between the two obviously sport is a hell of a lot more engaging and fun but i honestly feel that the car responds better to stop and go with the standard mode and it feels like there's less strain put on the clutch (i realise i may be completely wrong with that statement) as i don't have to apply as much initial pressure as i do in sport mode to get the car moving - and you have to do so quickly and sharply in sport from a stand still so you don't slip it at all. Non sport seems to pick up straight away in stop and go.

 

In regards to Corsa mode, i'm no Jenson Button, Lewis Hamilton or whoever the hell else races in Yawn-1. In my ownership experience i've used it literally less than 5 times. It is very aggressive but it does wake the car up and on spirited runs gives you a hell of a lot of interaction. I've not had it in corsa for more than 10 mins or so, the weather is nice and sunny so in a minute i'll purely use Corsa and report back. Personally i've never really seen a need to use it here in London as Sport mode is perfect when there's no traffic. Additionally, i've not used the launch mode since buying the car - something i doubt i'll do anyway.

 

In regards to clutch wear - when i had the car go in a couple months ago for some warranty work on a squeeking sound, they gave me a read out of 2% wear. I'd say that's pretty impressive, though do note i have never driven the car in automatic mode and am very perceptive with the way i use neutral when coasting or coming to a stop, even for a second or two.

 

Josh

Haven't driven it in Sports or Corsa modes!? Maybe I should push them buttons to give them a try!

 

Always thought that Corsa mode is used for "launch" mode, but I guess we can DD in Corsa huh?

 

Kisco, so you're saying in Corsa mode, our car drives very jerky (whiplashes) and there are loud noises every time we shift (both up & down?)? Interesting!

Conversely when I got my GTR, I thought the shifting was 'too soft'!

 

I thought there was something wrong the trans...Almost like it was slipping, or wasn't even sure if it was in gear.

 

I guess it's all what you've been exposed to, and what you're used to from the past.

 

I personally love the way the 560 shifts, and even more so in the Aventador. DCT, while it may be faster, is certainly missing something...

 

And ToofDoc, you haven't driven in Corsa yet!!!!??!??!??!?? Yikes!

Man, you guys are all crazy.. (kidding, I understand that you enjoy taking a an Easton to the back of the noggin )

 

Kisco, so you're saying in Corsa mode, our car drives very jerky (whiplashes) and there are loud noises every time we shift (both up & down?)? Interesting!

 

Not exactly. What I am saying is that when driving spiritedly (WOT and shifting at 7K-8K RPMS) in Corsa mode, the car shifts too aggressive. On the other hand, shifting at 3-4K RPMS in corsa mode while daily commuting is not as punishing (I still prefer sport mode though)

 

Just take a look at this guy's body motion when shifting in corsa mode and my complaint becomes very apparent. What you don't capture in this video is the physical feeling you acquire on each shift - which is the feeling of the tranny ready to take a dump on you..lol

 

 

In conclusion, I get it. Although I don't agree with your/lambos points of view and justification to the way the tranny is constructed, I understand the motive behind your sentiments. Everyone is different and like I said, it will come down to the individual's personality. Corsa is just not for me, that's all. Now that I realize there isn't anything wrong with my car and what I am experiencing in corsa mode is normal, all is well.

 

Thanks for the input.

Ok so drove for a few miles in corsa but got held up with traffic and was in a major rush, which added to the speed. It really does wake the car up but it feels like a mini slingshot and really unsettles the balance of the car if you're anything but completely straight whilst shifting. I'll give it a few more goes this week. Or not, shit i just remembered the car is going in for it's first service tomorrow!

And ToofDoc, you haven't driven in Corsa yet!!!!??!??!??!?? Yikes!

 

Nope, haven't driven in the Sports mode either. I know, I got to get it on! Got my car for about 6 weeks now, only got it out 4-5 times (limited majority by weather). Now the weather is nicer, I'll be doing some testing drives.

 

Can you switch switch between modes (sports, standard, corsa) on the move or does the car have to be at a complete stop?

Nope, haven't driven in the Sports mode either. I know, I got to get it on! Got my car for about 6 weeks now, only got it out 4-5 times (limited majority by weather). Now the weather is nicer, I'll be doing some testing drives.

 

Can you switch switch between modes (sports, standard, corsa) on the move or does the car have to be at a complete stop?

 

Damn..I think I put it in Corsa as I was pulling mine off the trailer. lol...

 

You can switch on the fly as much as you want.

 

Even the "Sport Auto" mode is pretty good....But I still suggest Corsa for all of your driving needs!

Is there another mode besides CORSA???

 

Just an FYI alert...

 

Carol (i.e. "cake") drives HER balloon white E-Gear 560 with Callistos in CORSA mode all day, every day.

 

Just an FYI...

 

I could not stand my 560 in any mode except Corsa during daily driving. All other modes felt sluggish. I would go out of my way to shift at WOT in Corsa, and also go hot into the brakes to hear the bark of the rev match. Can't believe you don't love the upshifts in Corsa, Kisco. They are great fun, even moreso in tunnels.

+1!!!

 

For me - it's the ONLY way to go. And I'm convinced that egear wear is minized in CORSA more so than the other modes. The shifting action is completed faster in CORSA which means less time that bits/pieces are touching/grinding - so faster = less wear. Lambo techs confirm this.

 

Kisco - you can keep it in CORSA and just lift a bit when you shift - it softens the experience and takes the edge off.

 

I can't stand SPORT mode and I can't tolerate AUTO even for a short time. They seem so slow and sluggish - it's like waiting for the other shoe to drop. Gets on my nerves.

 

Andy - you need to drive in CORSA!!! It's the LAMBO way

 

Actually - it's a personal preference - and however you most enjoy your lambo is how you should drive it. I love the "sledgehammer" feel of WOT CORSA shifts. There is nothing else like it.

 

 

 

 

Does WOT stand for pressing your gas pedal all the way down to the floor?

Does WOT stand for pressing your gas pedal all the way down to the floor?

Wide Open Throttle

My next mod....(thanks Dave @ Fabspeed for making this for me )