Things are getting crazy in Kiev

Wheels:

 

The latest ones.

For the record I haven't seen any of the movies or TV shows you referenced.

 

But the Godfather movies are worth watching.

 

 

Back on topic:

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/07/23/pu...world-for-help/

 

You should at least see Avatar, it is fantastic in terms of the special effects, and much better than the Star Wars films.

Wheels:

 

The latest ones.

 

I see; they weren't everyone's taste, I know Romandad didn't care for them either. Myself, I never cared for the Lord of the Rings films and those were hugely popular too.

Putin's song:

 

The original Star Wars were awesome and still are. The new one ones sucked big donkey balls. I have high hopes for the new one being made. It sounds like there's going to be an attempt to get back to basics.

 

I hope so. May the force be with you....always.

The victims return home.

 

May they rest in peace they were senselessly murdered by scumbags who will never be brought to justice!

The victims return home.

 

 

Amazing, awe inspiring, humbling... just wow. Incredible picture that really should bring home just how horrible this tragedy is.

 

RIP to all those unfortunate souls...

 

In other news:

 

http://news.yahoo.com/evidence-moscow-firi...-181508795.html

 

Washington (AFP) - The United States on Thursday said it had evidence Russian forces were firing artillery from inside Russia on Ukrainian troops, in what officials called a "clear escalation" of the conflict.

 

Putin's reaction to all that happened is absolutely disgusting and shows his cynicism has no limits. What I find more disgusting is that he is more popular than he has ever been in Russia with an 83% approval rating. They have no humanity.

 

I wish Europeans would stop mucking about and start fracking to replace gas imports from Russia. Nothing would hurt them more, and it's the only chance that thug in Moscow will ever get booted out of his office.

 

An interesting opinion on Russia by Max Skibinsky a russian american entrepreneur.

 

http://skibinsky.com/no-russian/

RIP to all those unfortunate souls...

 

In other news:

 

http://news.yahoo.com/evidence-moscow-firi...-181508795.html

 

 

 

Putin's reaction to all that happened is absolutely disgusting and shows his cynicism has no limits. What I find more disgusting is that he is more popular than he has ever been in Russia with an 83% approval rating. They have no humanity.

 

I wish Europeans would stop mucking about and start fracking to replace gas imports from Russia. Nothing would hurt them more, and it's the only chance that thug in Moscow will ever get booted out of his office.

 

An interesting opinion on Russia by Max Skibinsky a russian american entrepreneur.

 

http://skibinsky.com/no-russian/

 

 

your notion that if europe starts fracking (which is a very debateable subject on its own) and refuses to purchase russian gas, that this will in turn hurt russia is untrue. russia is already two steps ahead,they signed a $400 billion, 30 year deal with china to supply them with gas. oil and gas are very fungible and worst comes to worst russia can undercut the market if it NEEDED to move its resources. Unfortunately as much as i hate seeing the position that russia has put europe in, theres really no alternative for them in the short term

your notion that if europe starts fracking (which is a very debateable subject on its own) and refuses to purchase russian gas, that this will in turn hurt russia is untrue. russia is already two steps ahead,they signed a $400 billion, 30 year deal with china to supply them with gas. oil and gas are very fungible and worst comes to worst russia can undercut the market if it NEEDED to move its resources. Unfortunately as much as i hate seeing the position that russia has put europe in, theres really no alternative for them in the short term

Short term no, medium to long surely. China can't buy up all the gas Russia produces, Europe is still the biggest customer by far. It will hurt them , they are one step above the middle eastern oil economies, oil&gas is their livelihood. Also in order to extract that oil&gas they need western technology and western companies. And even if they manage to find new customers their leverage in Europe will be greatly diminished.

Short term no, medium to long surely. China can't buy up all the gas Russia produces, Europe is still the biggest customer by far. It will hurt them , they are one step above the middle eastern oil economies, oil&gas is their livelihood. Also in order to extract that oil&gas they need western technology and western companies. And even if they manage to find new customers their leverage in Europe will be greatly diminished.

 

but thats the problem in itself...this conflict is short term. so while its possible to find a replacement long term that means that europe will have to start looking now and continue working in that direction even when the issue with russia calms down and everything goes back to normal.

 

russia has a competative advantage supplying its gas to europe because it has built the infrastructure for direct supply by pipeline. lets say europe will look to the middle east for LNG, because that LNG would have to be transported by ship that will add costs and then youd have to store it and refine it, passing on the increased prices to consumers will hurt leaders in elections. europes only choice would be fracking (i doubt it) or to take a country like uzbekistan and invest in a pipeline but europe will have to foot the bill for construction (why do this when russia has a pipeline built and ready to go?) and this will definitely increase tension in the eurasian region

 

although china cannot buy up all of russias gas, russia expanding east definitely creates bigger oppertunities. asia currently has a big need for gas which leads them to pay large premiums on it, especially japan (who is the largest LNG importer in the world) which has already had talks for $6 billion gas pipeline project with russia

but thats the problem in itself...this conflict is short term. so while its possible to find a replacement long term that means that europe will have to start looking now and continue working in that direction even when the issue with russia calms down and everything goes back to normal.

 

russia has a competative advantage supplying its gas to europe because it has built the infrastructure for direct supply by pipeline. lets say europe will look to the middle east for LNG, because that LNG would have to be transported by ship that will add costs and then youd have to store it and refine it, passing on the increased prices to consumers will hurt leaders in elections. europes only choice would be fracking (i doubt it) or to take a country like uzbekistan and invest in a pipeline but europe will have to foot the bill for construction (why do this when russia has a pipeline built and ready to go?) and this will definitely increase tension in the eurasian region

 

although china cannot buy up all of russias gas, russia expanding east definitely creates bigger oppertunities. asia currently has a big need for gas which leads them to pay large premiums on it, especially japan (who is the largest LNG importer in the world) which has already had talks for $6 billion gas pipeline project with russia

Fracking would be enough to cover Europe's gas needs. Just as the US did it in the span of a few years so can Europe. It doesn't matter if Russians find new customers for gas, the issue here is their leverage in Europe. The moment Europe doesn't need Russian gas anymore, WE get the upper hand. Russia will still need Europe in order to fulfill its obligations to their Asian customers, they will still need access to western capital markets, Russian oligarchs will still want to live, invest and send their children to Europe, they are not going to do that in China or Japan. I wouldn't care if they get more leverage over the Chinese, the main goal is to reduce it in Europe, so that when they feel the need to flex their muscle we can sanction them into compliance without major economic consequences for us but with dire ones for them.

 

Russians are not a dependable partner for the future, they have proven it time and time again. Something has to be done about them, the status quo isn't helping anyone.

Fracking would be enough to cover Europe's gas needs. Just as the US did it in the span of a few years so can Europe.

 

 

like i mentioned, fraking is very debateable and there are positives and negatives associated with it which is an entire new discussion all on its own. theres also the question of cost associated with fracking, im sure after running the numbers and the positives and negatives europe decided its cheaper and more efficient to buy the gas from russia. if it was all as easy as you say, trust me this would have been done years ago as fracking isnt necessarily a new technology but unfortunately it presents its own challenges.

 

 

The moment Europe doesn't need Russian gas anymore, WE get the upper hand.

 

 

what exactly does this mean? upper hand in what? negotiations? strongarming a country into submission? i mentioned this earlier, thats the bully mentality of the united states.

 

 

Russians are not a dependable partner for the future, they have proven it time and time again. Something has to be done about them, the status quo isn't helping anyone.

 

 

actually i would argue that in terms of business, russia is very dependable and i cannot find a single case that shows otherwise, how are they proving themselves to be unrealiable (politics aside)? sure russia is a twisted country, its president is an asshole but theres a reason why europe does business with russia (both import and export) and thats because its a good deal for them, its mainly the united states that doesnt like this arrangement and is pushing for a sanction.

 

russia isnt doing anything that the united states hasnt done, shooting down planes and invading other countries? yeah united states has done it but no one is getting bent out of shape over that. like i mentioned i dont agree with russia, i think putin is an asshole but push comes to shove i have a feeling that deep down inside europe rather do business with russia than the united states. the US operates with too much ulterior motive

like i mentioned, fraking is very debateable and there are positives and negatives associated with it which is an entire new discussion all on its own. theres also the question of cost associated with fracking, im sure after running the numbers and the positives and negatives europe decided its cheaper and more efficient to buy the gas from russia. if it was all as easy as you say, trust me this would have been done years ago as fracking isnt necessarily a new technology but unfortunately it presents its own challenges.

 

 

 

what exactly does this mean? upper hand in what? negotiations? strongarming a country into submission? i mentioned this earlier, thats the bully mentality of the united states.

 

 

 

actually i would argue that in terms of business, russia is very dependable and i cannot find a single case that shows otherwise, how are they proving themselves to be unrealiable (politics aside)? sure russia is a twisted country, its president is an asshole but theres a reason why europe does business with russia (both import and export) and thats because its a good deal for them, its mainly the united states that doesnt like this arrangement and is pushing for a sanction.

 

russia isnt doing anything that the united states hasnt done, shooting down planes and invading other countries? yeah united states has done it but no one is getting bent out of shape over that. like i mentioned i dont agree with russia, i think putin is an asshole but push comes to shove i have a feeling that deep down inside europe rather do business with russia than the united states. the US operates with too much ulterior motive

 

The only reason large scale shale gas exploitations aren't in operation yet, are the greenies... It's moving forward slowly. It is more cost efficient, in both monetary and political terms. There may be positives and negatives but the positive of getting rid of Russian dependency far outweighs everything else imo.

 

Upper hand in situations such as the ones of the past 6 months, when Russian aggression needs to be contained and countered. Bully mentality? Are you kidding me? I guess you feel the Russians are merely caught in the middle and have no hand or fault in the events in Ukraine?

The Russians have to be strongarmed, there is little else they understand, much like every other uncivilized and backward society on the planet. Asking them nicely isn't going to cut it unfortunately. Past 6 years with Obama should have made it clear by now that "niceness" gets you nowhere in international politics. Go ahead, ask ISIS nicely to go home, ask Putin nicely to get out of Ukraine, ask the Chinese nicely to let go of their Asian dominance ambitions, ask the drug cartels nicely to stop dealing drugs etc. You see where I'm going with this?

 

Russia dependable? You don't live in Europe do you? Just in the past few years I recall at least 3 instances of them cutting off gas supplies in the middle of winter, and hundreds of threats to do so because of their spats with transiting countries. That's dependability in your view? I'm sorry but no. The Arabs with the exception of the 70's embargo on the US , have been far more reliable in their delivery of energy. Also a dependable partner doesn't use a vital resource as a bargaining chip when it doesn't get what it wants. Because this is what they do these days. They act like little children and threaten everyone with cutting off gas in order to get their way. They are the bully, not Europe!

 

The US is right in pushing for more sanctions and it took the deaths of 300 innocent people in order for the fractured EU to take a stand. Yes it's easy to get energy from Russia but there are alternatives, it is politically stupid to rely on an undemocratic Russia for energy considering the way they've used this tool in the past. Trade with Russia is important to the EU, but it is far more important to Russia. What exactly can they do? Stop buying luxury cars and make their own? Stop investing in Europe? That's laughable... They are one step above the oil economies of the middle east, they produce nothing of any significant value to world markets other than raw materials. When was the last time you bought a Russian made product outside of a gas station? No one sane is keeping their fortunes in Russia precisely because of the political system. Since the beginning of the year capital flight from Russia is at the 100 bln mark.

 

I assure you the EU would rather do business with the US or anyone else than deal with Putin's whims. Russia has bitten off the hand the feeds them, many people who were unconvinced until now, have no more reason to doubt dependency on Russia is bad for Europe.

 

Russia may not be doing anything the US hasn't done but you need to look at these things in a historical context. Russia in the past 100 years has done far worse things than the US ever did. That is, they butchered tens of millions of their own people, and condemned hundreds of millions to misery and poverty for two generations with the destructive ideology and political system they imposed on them. Let's not forget who started WW2, it was Germany and Russia who invaded Poland. The only reason they were treated as allies was because the Nazis turned on them, and the west had little alternative. They were a belligerent nation in WW2. The US hasn't quite managed to pull crap like that off.

 

Meanwhile the Germans have changed their ways, the Russians have not, they are still the backward and unenlightened society they were 70 years ago, but with iphones and SUVs. And yes I can call them backward and uncivilized, as I'd call any nation who supports a sinister man like Putin to lead them. 83% approval rating for that thug... Says a lot about the Russians don't you think? You should see the absolutely disgusting theories the Russian Kremlin controlled media is putting forward in regards to the downing of MH17, some sources went as far as to say the airplane was full of dead bodies and it was all a western conspiracy to make Putin look bad.

Meanwhile the Germans have changed their ways, the Russians have not, they are still the backward and unenlightened society they were 70 years ago, but with iphones and SUVs. And yes I can call them backward and uncivilized, as I'd call any nation who supports a sinister man like Putin to lead them. 83% approval rating for that thug... Says a lot about the Russians don't you think?

 

great that you bring up germany. germany has always lead the pact when it comes to the EU, if you look at any historic decisions they always rely on germany to back them. at the moment germany is significant because they have the largest trade balance with russia both importing and exporting. russia and germany (putin started his kgb career in east germany) have pretty close relations and i feel like the only way to cut russia out of europe would be to turn germany against them but that wont be possible because too much money is at stake, germany would struggle too much economically to sanction russia. putin is too connected to the right people and continues to reward them. example; former chancellor shroder was the one who pushed for nord stream pipeline, mattias warnig a former stasi agent, 2 of many who have been rewarded for their loyalty to putin by being put on boards of large russian companies, etc.

 

its not just russians who approve of him, its people who do business with him who support him as mentioned above, putin only needs to know the right people and the majority dont matter, as long as he gets his point across to those who make decisions what the rest think is irrelevant. if putin puts pressure on his german allies to stop fraking, guess what? germany will put pressue on their neighbor countries to cut it out and it will, if fraking is so amazing as you say, im pretty sure its not the greenies that are stopping it, its the muscle that matters. for this reason im pretty sure nothing will happen, i give it 3 months before iran starts threatning israel with its new nuclear weapons and things really hit the fan in the middle east, or china starts to invade taiwan, at that point russia will once again be a distant memory. as long as russia is good for business it will stay where it is and russia knows this.

 

i would disagree with you on one thing. while russia isnt perfect its a better trade partner for europe than america is, actually america has nothing to offer europe

great posts vvs and ameer

great that you bring up germany. germany has always lead the pact when it comes to the EU, if you look at any historic decisions they always rely on germany to back them. at the moment germany is significant because they have the largest trade balance with russia both importing and exporting. russia and germany (putin started his kgb career in east germany) have pretty close relations and i feel like the only way to cut russia out of europe would be to turn germany against them but that wont be possible because too much money is at stake, germany would struggle too much economically to sanction russia. putin is too connected to the right people and continues to reward them. example; former chancellor shroder was the one who pushed for nord stream pipeline, mattias warnig a former stasi agent, 2 of many who have been rewarded for their loyalty to putin by being put on boards of large russian companies, etc.

 

its not just russians who approve of him, its people who do business with him who support him as mentioned above, putin only needs to know the right people and the majority dont matter, as long as he gets his point across to those who make decisions what the rest think is irrelevant. if putin puts pressure on his german allies to stop fraking, guess what? germany will put pressue on their neighbor countries to cut it out and it will, if fraking is so amazing as you say, im pretty sure its not the greenies that are stopping it, its the muscle that matters. for this reason im pretty sure nothing will happen, i give it 3 months before iran starts threatning israel with its new nuclear weapons and things really hit the fan in the middle east, or china starts to invade taiwan, at that point russia will once again be a distant memory. as long as russia is good for business it will stay where it is and russia knows this.

 

i would disagree with you on one thing. while russia isnt perfect its a better trade partner for europe than america is, actually america has nothing to offer europe

Well the thing is Germany is to Europe what the US is to the world albeit on a smaller scale. Everyone loves to hate them but everyone needs them.

 

You are right about Putin's connection but are wrong in your assesment of their nature. Luckily we live in a free accountable and democratic society. Putin can not behave in Europe as he does at home. There are limits to his influence. Much of the anti fracking ptopaganda has been financed by Russian ngos at least in my country which is sits on some of the largest shale gas reserves in eastern Europe.

Disasters such as the downing the mh17 flight are among said limits. When it becomes too politically sensitive to suport Putin his influence falters. In Europe politicians can't simply do whatever they please as is the case in Russia. You also can't tolerate Russian bullying simply to preserve economic relations. There are "red lines". What next? He invades the Baltic countries and no one says a peep because we need to keep the factories churning and the people employed? Such a scenario would be unacceptable. He needs to know we mean business. Best way to do it is to hurt his finances.

 

Us and Eu are each others biggest trade partners. Of course we both have a lot to offer each other. Just because American trucks don't sell in Europe doesn't mean there isn't any business going on. Trade, scientific, cultural and military ties between the US and Eu weigh far more than any collective ties to Russia. Russia is just a market for luxury goods and a gas station. Just like the middle east.

 

Us puts tanks to lithuania, latvia, estonia. Russians are over the ukraine border with heavy vehicles this is really worrying for us.

Us puts tanks to lithuania, latvia, estonia. Russians are over the ukraine border with heavy vehicles this is really worrying for us.

 

The U.S. has no heavy armor in Europe. It was removed because no one thought it would be needed anymore. Unless they have started putting it back in recently.

Internally displaced people in Ukraine are in the hundreds of thousands atm, add to that another 100-150k who have already fled to Russia. Numbers have sharply risen over the past month. The situation is escalating.

The U.S. has no heavy armor in Europe. It was removed because no one thought it would be needed anymore. Unless they have started putting it back in recently.

That's what I meant. Heavy armor has started to come back to Baltia.

 

And russia is doing this, sorry about the faded white paint on the lorries:

 

 

Situation on site is escalating quickly because water supply has been cut and electricity too..

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-29109398

 

MH17 disaster: Russians 'controlled BUK missile system'