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The new V12 Lamborghini hybrid (Aventador successor)


Luckydaff
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On 12/30/2022 at 6:28 AM, Luckydaff said:

Do we have anything else to mention about the new car? Someone here must know something juicy.

Tons of juicy info but bound by the NDA we had to sign at the preview.

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14 minutes ago, sl55 said:

Tons of juicy info but bound by the NDA we had to sign at the preview.

That’s awesome. How was the preview event? At a dealer or off-site? 

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12 minutes ago, Destructo said:

That’s awesome. How was the preview event? At a dealer or off-site? 

Preview was at the NYC lounge. and it was great. Spent just over an hour and went through the different specs. The AVR will be a game changer for the brand.

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10 hours ago, sl55 said:

Preview was at the NYC lounge. and it was great. Spent just over an hour and went through the different specs. The AVR will be a game changer for the brand.

I get that you are under embargo as of right now. Did they give you guys any date when you can talk :)? Game Changer ey?! Sounds interesting! Right now the name of the car and the V12's displacement is what I really wanna find out :) I'll keep on fishing I guess.

Btw, How close from 1-10 would you say this render is to the real deal?

Skärmavbild 2023-01-02 kl. 15.31.03.png

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Game-changer for the Lamborghini brand perhaps but not for the super-car sector (my personal opinion, of course).

Styling-wise, like most of the modern bulls, it will take time to fully appreciate it.  Not bad but Borkert & his team are no where near Gandini's level; perheps not even Perini's.

Official lauch currently set at end of March. 

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17 hours ago, VCR said:

Game-changer for the Lamborghini brand perhaps but not for the super-car sector (my personal opinion, of course).

Styling-wise, like most of the modern bulls, it will take time to fully appreciate it.  Not bad but Borkert & his team are no where near Gandini's level; perheps not even Perini's.

Official lauch currently set at end of March. 

I actually came across a picture today of a small part of the rear. From what I saw I was not impressed. I really hope when I get to see the real car in the end of March that I was wrong today. But right now I am very worried that Mitja Borkert cocked it up. I am not a fan of his work for Lambo if I am honest. He is no Gandini or Perini that's for sure.

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5 hours ago, Luckydaff said:

I actually came across a picture today of a small part of the rear. From what I saw I was not impressed. I really hope when I get to see the real car in the end of March that I was wrong today. But right now I am very worried that Mitja Borkert cocked it up. I am not a fan of his work for Lambo if I am honest. He is no Gandini or Perini that's for sure.

Thank you!  I am glad you said it first.  I am definitely not a fan of Borkert's work.  I've met and chatted with Borket at the Sian preview and at the Huracan Technica launch.  The guy has a thing about Countach.  That's fine but rather than mimicking the so-called Gandini Line, how about trying to invent something of his own instead of hiding under Gandini's shadow and butchering his work by reinterpreting it, e.g. the New Countach which he had totally ruined --- to the point that Gandini issued a statement denouncing it.

Anyway, I have digressed.  There is a small styling element on this new flagship which had never appeared on any V12 Lamborghini before.  But it's not something epic that would redefine the styling motif on the supercar genre.  Any car enthusiast worth his salt already knew about the engine bay part so no need to and I cannot elaborate on it.  Put it this way: again, my personal opinion of course, the first impression on this car is defintely neither "wow!!" nor "holy smokes, that's hot!"; but rather, "huh, 10 years have passed and this is it?!"  There are no top marks from its initial impression for sure.  But it will grow on you after you are aware of the how's and why's.  But for that 4-second attention span if one sees it on the road, I don't think it's anything to write home about.  Lastly, for those who consider the Aventador is already too big of a car, well, guess what?...  As for performance and tech, as much as I hate to concede to it --- it's Lamborghini, a small manufacturer under the VAG umbrella shared by Porsche and Bentley.  It can, at best, match or edge a tiny bit ahead of them; but can it be allowed to outright supersede them by a giant leap; especially on Porsche?  I think the answer seems obvious.

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Borkert should design a tombstone for Centro Stile. It saddens me to say this because my love of cars started out with Lamborghini. Back when I was a kid I used to see a black Diablo on my way to preschool and it was love at first sight. Ever since that first day I saw it I have always had Lambo at the top. Along with Koenigsegg but they are not really in the same class. But Lambo is slowly slipping away. Trouble is I don't feel any sort of love and massive passion for any other brad. McLaren is crap, Ferrari is a bit too safe imo, Porsche can be amazingly epic, but can also be amazingly boring. So Lambo needs to sack Ze German and get a proper design boss to save its reputation and brand. I never thought I would say that. But I just did.

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On 1/2/2023 at 9:27 AM, Luckydaff said:

I get that you are under embargo as of right now. Did they give you guys any date when you can talk :)? Game Changer ey?! Sounds interesting! Right now the name of the car and the V12's displacement is what I really wanna find out :) I'll keep on fishing I guess.

Btw, How close from 1-10 would you say this render is to the real deal?

Skärmavbild 2023-01-02 kl. 15.31.03.png

What a disappointment if accurate. A blend of Sian, Huracan and Aventador. I suppose I should pay more attention, but since the announcement of a hybrid I’ve paid so little attention to it…just bleh. 

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I can't speak for others but I was wow'd by the car when I saw it person. There's a lot of design cues and aero which are hidden under the camo on the test mules but overall the car looks aggressive and what a V12 Lambo should look like. The performance is also leaps ahead of the Aventador.

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12 hours ago, Luckydaff said:

Borkert should design a tombstone for Centro Stile. It saddens me to say this because my love of cars started out with Lamborghini. Back when I was a kid I used to see a black Diablo on my way to preschool and it was love at first sight. Ever since that first day I saw it I have always had Lambo at the top. Along with Koenigsegg but they are not really in the same class. But Lambo is slowly slipping away. Trouble is I don't feel any sort of love and massive passion for any other brad. McLaren is crap, Ferrari is a bit too safe imo, Porsche can be amazingly epic, but can also be amazingly boring. So Lambo needs to sack Ze German and get a proper design boss to save its reputation and brand. I never thought I would say that. But I just did.

Borkert IS the tombstone for Centro Stile.  Look at his so-called credentials: he came from Porsche.  While I have huge admiration for Porsche, they are also the laziest stylist: take a 911 shell and give a nip & tuck here and there, bingo!  It's done.  (Like you said, they are both epic and boring.)  And that's exactly what Borkert had done: a mish-mash of Aventador, Huracan and Countach! :eusa_wall:  To be fair, the design isn't bad; but it's augmentation rather than creation/invention.  For those who knew the history of the brand and Gandini's design philosophy, we have seen much better designs coming out of the Charging Bull Brand.  E.g. The styling of the Miura and the Countach could not be further apart; an yet it came from the same man!  Add the Espada and a few others onto his list, you will then realize just how versatile and how much of a genius Gandini is!  Donckewolke and Perini aren't bad either; they had captured the essence of the Italian supercar's styling motifs.  

Ever since Audi/VAG bought Lamborghini, the Germans have been slowly but surely taking over the brand.  While Winkelmann grew up in Italy, he's German afterall.  Perini was replaced by Borkert.  And, lastly, Maurizio Reggiani was replaced by Rouven Mohr.  CEO, Head of Centro Stile & CTO; 3 top positions all held by Germans.  While I applaud the German's no-nonsense efficiency and precision engineering, their product can feel sterile.  An Italian supercar, IMO, needs the flair to make it interesting and cool.  I cannot describe it in words but one knows it when one sees it; and I haven't seen that from Lamborghini ever since the Aventador S came out (Borkert's first work at Lamborghini).  And his latest is no exception either.  As to performance, well, it better be superior since a decade had passed since the Aventador debut and its performance & tech had long been matched or superseded by other brands.

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12 hours ago, sl55 said:

I can't speak for others but I was wow'd by the car when I saw it person. There's a lot of design cues and aero which are hidden under the camo on the test mules but overall the car looks aggressive and what a V12 Lambo should look like. The performance is also leaps ahead of the Aventador.

That gives me a bit of comfort. The picture I was shown was of like 25% of the rear of the car. So I have no idea how most of the car looks yet. But I am a bit worried. 

 

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3 hours ago, Luckydaff said:

That gives me a bit of comfort. The picture I was shown was of like 25% of the rear of the car. So I have no idea how most of the car looks yet. But I am a bit worried. 

 

Like every new Lamborghini model it takes time to appreciate the design. I remember when the SVJ came out most people hated it, called too busy and preferred the SV. Now of course opinions have changed for most people and the SVJ is considered one of the best looking variants.

I don't think people will be overly disappointed with the replacement. It's wide, it's long and it'll have the road presence every V12 has had in years past.

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On 1/4/2023 at 11:13 PM, sl55 said:

I can't speak for others but I was wow'd by the car when I saw it person. There's a lot of design cues and aero which are hidden under the camo on the test mules but overall the car looks aggressive and what a V12 Lambo should look like. The performance is also leaps ahead of the Aventador.

I am with you this.  I really like the new car and the features.  I was one of 100 at the Aventador replacement and I was wow'd at the time even when many early thought the Aventador was trash compared to the Murcie.  Many of those came around to love the Aventador.  I think the new car is at least as similar a leap or not more of the Murcie to Avy.  Patience guys--we will see unveiling soon.

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On 1/5/2023 at 11:15 PM, sl55 said:

Like every new Lamborghini model it takes time to appreciate the design. I remember when the SVJ came out most people hated it, called too busy and preferred the SV. Now of course opinions have changed for most people and the SVJ is considered one of the best looking variants.

I don't think people will be overly disappointed with the replacement. It's wide, it's long and it'll have the road presence every V12 has had in years past.

Not really. I still think SVJ is the ‘anija’ variant of Aventador out of the factory. Mitja and his team seem to enjoy messy and eye tiring busy designs.

This is the first time he’s in command of a totally new production car rather than a new surface to an existing model. imo, the pre-Mitja versions of Huracan, Aventador, or even Urus (the prototype) look better and will age better over time. I hope time will prove me wrong.

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Personally, I think the Aventador SV is the best looking model out of the Aventador series.  I had the original LP700 coupe, LP700 roadster, LP750SV coupe and currently have a LP770 SVJ63 roadster.  I like the SVJ63 merely for its slightly more updated tech and the increased performance; lookwise, it's the SV for me.  Modern Lamborghini's styling does take time to be fully appreciated.  People jeered about the SV when it first appeared but it "matured" over time.  Not the SVJ though, as one member had said above, it's overyly complicated with too many lines.  The Ultimae is even worse; just compare the noses on all iterations of the Aventador's and it becomes so obvious.  The Sian is no exception either.

Don't get me wrong, I am not trashing the new car.  As aforesaid, it not bad but it will take time to get used to.  Will the appreciation increase as time progresses, likely; but does it have the wow factor like every model that Gandini had done, regrettably, a definite no.  Also as aforesaid, Borkert is not creative or innovative at all.  Perini's Aventador was a complete departure from Donckerwolke's Murcielago.  It's still a Lamborghini without the slightest of doubt of course but it's a revolutionary new design.  Borkert's new flagship is more evolutionary and lacks creativity; there is still a strong Aventador undertone lurking within the new car.  Is the design a failure, no it isn't.  But is it an epic design like the former generations of V12 flagships, no it isn't that either, absolutely not.  Performance-wise, admittedly, the Aventador's tech was obsolete years ago; Lamborghini managed to milk it for a few years more; kudos to them.  With the new flagship, Lamborghini has merely caught up with what is available today and perhaps, at best, equals what is there to come within the next couple of years.  Is there anything totally innovative about this car, again, a definitive no.  And one very important thing about Lamborghini: it doesn't care what the rest of the world thinks and prefers; Lamborghini does it in its own way regardless of styling and tech.  I don't see that in this new car.  It neither has the F-U-we'll-do-it-our-way, nor we'll-have-something-that-no-one-had-done-or-imagined-before attitude.  That, to me, is a major disappointment.  

Having said all that, I am not totally negative towards it.  Would I get one?  Likely, but not in the immediate future.  Given all the limitations that's being enforced (those who attended the preview know what I am referring to), I don't see the point.  No need to be the first to own the latest.  And we knew that it can only get better as time progresses.

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On 1/8/2023 at 7:45 AM, DoctaM3 said:

I am with you this.  I really like the new car and the features.  I was one of 100 at the Aventador replacement and I was wow'd at the time even when many early thought the Aventador was trash compared to the Murcie.  Many of those came around to love the Aventador.  I think the new car is at least as similar a leap or not more of the Murcie to Avy.  Patience guys--we will see unveiling soon.

The entire event was well put together. A lot of details about the car and what the brand has planned for the future. I think most people will like what they see when the car is finally unveiled in March.

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Received an update on Unica this morning with the 9 preconfigs. I assume we'll receive another update with the spec we picked.

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33 minutes ago, sl55 said:

Received an update on Unica this morning with the 9 preconfigs. I assume we'll receive another update with the spec we picked.

Can you share something about the Unica App update? I am not an owner. Just a massive fan of the Lamborghini Brand so I do not get these things :P

 

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