pockmark Report post Posted February 4, 2011 Proposed Shotgun Import Ban Shows Need To Change Law http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Feder ... px?id=6172 Friday, January 28, 2011 On Thursday, Jan. 27, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives released a Study on the Importability of Certain Shotguns, which proposes that “military shotguns, or shotguns with common military features that are unsuitable for traditional shotgun sports” be prohibited from importation. This would apply to all shotguns—not just semi-automatics. As in previous “working group” studies on rifles, the study fails to give proper credit to the widespread use of these guns in newer shooting sports, or to their adaptability to hunting. The study underscores the need for Congress to change the firearm importation law. That law requires the Attorney General to approve the importation of any firearm “generally recognized as particularly suitable for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes.” This “sporting purposes” test was imposed by the Gun Control Act in 1968, a time when the right to self-defense with a firearm was not as widely respected by the courts as it is today. Clearly, the main reason to change the law is that the Second Amendment—as the Supreme Court said in District of Columbia v. Heller—protects our right to keep and bear arms for defense, not for sports. In its 2008 Heller decision, the court observed that “the inherent right of self-defense has been central to the Second Amendment right” and ruled that the Second Amendment protects “the individual right to possess and carry weapons in case of confrontation,” particularly within the home, where “the need for defense of self, family, and property is most acute.” The court also dismissed the notion that the amendment doesn’t protect modern arms, saying “Just as the First Amendment protects modern forms of communications and the Fourth Amendment applies to modern forms of search, the Second Amendment extends, prima facie, to all instruments that constitute bearable arms.” Another reason to change the law is to end the BATFE’s 22-year history of misinterpreting it. In 1989, the bureau banned the importation of semi-automatic rifles, claiming they were not used for “organized marksmanship competition.” (In fact, the banned guns were of the type most commonly used by competitors in the most popular marksmanship competitions in the United States—the National Matches, and the hundreds of local, state and regional competitions that precede the national events each year.) In 1998, BATFE expanded the ban, absurdly claiming that semi-automatic rifles’ “suitability for this activity [marksmanship competition] is limited.” At the time, a Clinton White House official said “we’re taking the law and bending it as far as we can to capture a whole new class of guns.” Now, BATFE is bending the law one more time. As this issue develops, the NRA will be looking at every legislative and legal option to bring our firearms import laws back in line with the Constitution. NRA members and other concerned gun owners can submit comments on the study until May 1, 2011. Comments may be submitted by e-mail to [email protected] or by fax to (202)648-9601. Faxed comments may not exceed five pages. All comments must include name and mailing address. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Report post Posted February 4, 2011 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destructo Report post Posted February 4, 2011 Son of a... who wants to start an American tactical shotgun manufacturing company? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedGTS Report post Posted February 4, 2011 I can't help but chuckle every time I hear some politician or anti-gun activist say we should ban this or that weapon "because its only purpose is to kill people!" Well, duh, that's exactly why I want a couple laying around you morons, in case I should need to kill someone in defense of myself or my family. I like sport shooting too, but I sleep a lot better with a loaded Glock in the nightstand than with a case full of unloaded hunting weapons upstairs. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pockmark Report post Posted February 4, 2011 Could get you some work doing an NRA vs. ATF case.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pockmark Report post Posted February 4, 2011 I can't help but chuckle every time I hear some politician or anti-gun activist say we should ban this or that weapon "because its only purpose is to kill people!" Well, duh, that's exactly why I want a couple laying around you morons, in case I should need to kill someone in defense of myself or my family. I like sport shooting too, but I sleep a lot better with a loaded Glock in the nightstand than with a case full of unloaded hunting weapons upstairs. Just bought 2 more mags for my 9mm S&W. Now have a total of 4 which means i have 65 rounds ready to go under my bed. If I can't hit something with that many rounds, I deserve to get shot. Also have the Benelli with Buckshot in my safe. It is a very short barrel and semiautomatic. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin2772 Report post Posted February 4, 2011 Gun control is the biggest fcuking joke going. Those who want the guns to commit the crimes, are going to get the guns regardless. It amazes me that their are people in the government that are too fcuking stupid to understand this concept and think that by banning certain types of guns, you are going to do ANYTHING to curb violence and crime. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedGTS Report post Posted February 4, 2011 Just bought 2 more mags for my 9mm S&W. Now have a total of 4 which means i have 65 rounds ready to go under my bed. If I can't hit something with that many rounds, I deserve to get shot. Also have the Benelli with Buckshot in my safe. It is a very short barrel and semiautomatic. That's a sweet shotgun--how much? It's hard to beat a short barreled shotgun for home defense; the problem is finding a place to put it where it's close at hand. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Report post Posted February 4, 2011 Could get you some work doing an NRA vs. ATF case.... I know Don Kilmer and Chuck Michel.... Ill see what I can do... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLK85 Report post Posted February 4, 2011 That is so stupid when they ban "military style" guns. Just because it has a pistol grip it is all of a sudden a "military style" gun or because adding a pistol grip it all of a sudden makes it a lot more dangerous than it already was. Guns are dangerous in the wrong hands or in criminals hands. Adding/changing things on it doesnt change that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Report post Posted February 4, 2011 That is so stupid when they ban "military style" guns. Just because it has a pistol grip it is all of a sudden a "military style" gun or because adding a pistol grip it all of a sudden makes it a lot more dangerous than it already was. Guns are dangerous in the wrong hands or in criminals hands. Adding/changing things on it doesnt change that. Theyre not just after "Military guns" either... Hawaii introduces bill to ban the sale of squirt guns Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
vyce77 Report post Posted February 4, 2011 That's a sweet shotgun--how much? It's hard to beat a short barreled shotgun for home defense Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLK85 Report post Posted February 4, 2011 Theyre not just after "Military guns" either... Hawaii introduces bill to ban the sale of squirt guns WOW.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pockmark Report post Posted February 4, 2011 That's a sweet shotgun--how much? It's hard to beat a short barreled shotgun for home defense; the problem is finding a place to put it where it's close at hand. Thanks. My father and I both bought one each for $700 a piece. They are refurbished Tactical Short barreled shotguns (similar to the effect of a sawed off shotgun). Just to be able to buy them, you have to go see your lawyer to create an arms trust, then you have to apply for the permitting to purchase through the state which takes 3-4 months sometimes more. Then you have to get a $200 bond put on the paperwork, and carry the papers with you at all times. If you are caught without the arms trust documentation, you do not pass go, you do not collect $200, you go straight to jail. They are already going for upwards of $2000 a piece They have a light at the end as you can see in the photo, and all you do is press the pressure sensor, and it turns on. I want to get a better bulb in mine, so it blinds any assailants, and they can't see me nor what is about to hit them like a ton of bricks. It is a semi auto, so you dont here the loud chh-chh when you are cocking it which is also an added benefit. The issue is where do you keep it where its accessible. Again, if someone breaks in, my safe is closeby enough and hidden enough where I can pursue the intruder, and my wife can safely access the safe, and get the Benelli out without being seen if I get taken out. If the intruder doesn't come into the Master bedroom, She can access it while I get my gear ready, and I have a tactical belt that holds all my handgun gear, so if I run out of shells, they will be hit with the 65+ rounds from the 9mm. Point of the story, it would be a bad idea to break into my house, or Roman's house, or my father's house. My father's probably got similar to what I have seen Roman post. He has several AR15's, several AK47's, A few tactical M4's, several shotguns, glock .40, glock .45, couple 9mm's, Probably 15 revolvers, He just bought another sniper rifle, and I am trying to talk him into buying the .50 Barrett. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikeman Report post Posted February 4, 2011 This is total lunacy, Doesn't do a damn thing. Any decent gunsmith can take a sporting shotgun cut down the barrel and add the parts to make it a "ASSAULT" shotgun. Doesn't matter if its a pump or a semi-auto the actions are the same. The ATF knows this. To clarify when I say the actions are the same, I mean sporting vs assault shotgun, not that the actions in a semi-auto and pump are the same. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pockmark Report post Posted February 4, 2011 This is total lunacy, Doesn't do a damn thing. Any decent gunsmith can take a sporting shotgun cut down the barrel and add the parts to make it a "ASSAULT" shotgun. Doesn't matter if its a pump or a semi-auto the actions are the same. The ATF knows this. Same thing with manufacturing the pin that make tactical rifles go full auto. You can do it, but if your caught you go to jail. You get caught with a sawed off, you go to jail in FL. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gilligan740 Report post Posted February 4, 2011 I'm looking at a Mossberg 590A1 -- made in the USA! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikeman Report post Posted February 4, 2011 Same thing with manufacturing the pin that make tactical rifles go full auto. You can do it, but if your caught you go to jail. You get caught with a sawed off, you go to jail in FL. Not in texas you can cut down a shotgun as long as you keep to the legal length which is 18 inches,the same in most states. Its stupid the only way their going to accomplish anything is to change the legal barrel length to 24 inches. Wilson combat does this all the time you send them any remington 870 and they'll build you a "assault" shotgun. same thing can be done a semi-auto. A shotguns a shotgun. http://www.wilsoncombat.com/s_remingtion_steal.htm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blylek Report post Posted February 4, 2011 It is a semi auto, so you dont here the loud chh-chh when you are cocking it which is also an added benefit. Nice Shotgun! Personally I love the chh-chh sound...seems like it would be an excellent deterrent! *I hope like hell I never have to find out for sure* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFilipinoStig Report post Posted February 4, 2011 It's all about the importation, not about gun control. I would be willing to bet that American gun companies are pushing for this and would be more than happy to not have the competition. I forget the law, (RD will know it I'm sure), that banned the importation of 100% foreign built "assault rifles" (applying to semi autos). And before you say "My AK was made in Romania, or the HK SL8 was made in Germany....." PARTS were, and a certain % of the gun has to be manufactured here. It's nothing but protectionism... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Report post Posted February 4, 2011 It's all about the importation, not about gun control. I would be willing to bet that American gun companies are pushing for this and would be more than happy to not have the competition. I forget the law, (RD will know it I'm sure), that banned the importation of 100% foreign built "assault rifles" (applying to semi autos). And before you say "My AK was made in Romania, or the HK SL8 was made in Germany....." PARTS were, and a certain % of the gun has to be manufactured here. It's nothing but protectionism... 18 usc 922r Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikeman Report post Posted February 4, 2011 It's all about the importation, not about gun control. I would be willing to bet that American gun companies are pushing for this and would be more than happy to not have the competition. I forget the law, (RD will know it I'm sure), that banned the importation of 100% foreign built "assault rifles" (applying to semi autos). And before you say "My AK was made in Romania, or the HK SL8 was made in Germany....." PARTS were, and a certain % of the gun has to be manufactured here. It's nothing but protectionism... Bingo. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCL_Blackbird Report post Posted February 5, 2011 At least I can still have this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moronzilla Report post Posted February 5, 2011 At least I can still have this USAS 12 http://www.google.com/images?oe=utf-8&...280&bih=860 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enzo1317 Report post Posted February 5, 2011 From what I've been reading, the general consensus is the BATF may be going after the Saiga shotguns. ATF Study on the Importability of Certain Shotguns. Glad I picked up a Saiga-12 and 2 MD-20 drums a couple weeks ago Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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