Night Shift in Iraq

If any type of special device is successfully used, we will lose quite a bit of our personal freedoms. We will beg the guv, to take away our freedoms and bring 'security.' The next day will be a different world, in so many ways. It will be a tragedy.

Ive been to lots of air shows and seen many military planes fly. The F22 may be "old", but watching it fly for the first time last year that plane is AMAZING!!! I havent seen anything(civilian or military) fly like that plane does. It looks like its more agile than an Extra 300 imo.

I think there is only one plane more agile in the air than an F-22, it's a type of Russian Sukhoi. But in terms of the technology, the F-22 is eons beyond anything out there. F-16s and F-15s have to fire their afterburners just to keep up with what is normal cruising for the F-22. The plane is a stealth aircraft and is virtually undetectable. The F-16 and F-15 pilots that fly against it in training exercises go up and die constantly. It is super-maneuverable, with features that let you vary the direction of the exhaust. It can fly at supersonic speeds without afterburner. The avionics on it allow it to know all about any aircraft it comes into contact with before said planes will even have a shot at detecting it.

 

And that's just the un-classified stuff. The plane has a whole lot of stuff that is classified I am sure. The F-22's problem is it is TOO advanced. That's the whole reason it costs so much. All that high-tech costs a lot of money.

 

Unfortunately, President Obama killed the F-22 program, which I think was a mistake. They should have instead just cut it down to procuring the planes more slowly or something like that, but to outright kill it was a bad idea I think (unless it can be revived at some point in the future?).

Ive been to lots of air shows and seen many military planes fly. The F22 may be "old", but watching it fly for the first time last year that plane is AMAZING!!! I havent seen anything(civilian or military) fly like that plane does. It looks like its more agile than an Extra 300 imo.

 

What is even more amazing is that the aircraft is limited by what the human body can take, not the airframe. It is essentially limited by the computer. Fortunately or unfortunately the next generation of fighters may have to be unmanned so they are simply able to out maneuver the enemy. Think F-35/F-22 controlling dynamically superior unmanned fighters.

 

I love the F-22, but what I'm saying more or less, is that to our engineers its old, but to our enemies its new, superior, and frightening.

 

The F-22 is the Bugatti Veyron of fighter aircraft, I don't think it will be surpassed for a loooooooong time.

 

All aircraft I'd think by the time they get to service, are "old," because they have to undergo years of testing before they can enter service. Even other military vehicles, for example the Abrams battle tank uses a gas turbine that is technically outdated, the replacement engine that is smaller and "newer" has been offered I think for twenty years now, so even that would be outdated probably if they replaced the Abrams's current engine with it.

If the government funded any technology to be created, it could have been done in the academic setting for a fraction of the cost. The government overpays so egregiously that it incentivises the contractor to deliver the goods that are barely sufficient. There is a reaosn why the phrase, "close enough for government work" came about. Any technology that came about through defense spending was a massive waste of money.

 

Bottom line, we could cut our spending next year in half and nothing would change on a safety level.

you obviously dont know what your talking about, if wall street was nuked the united states would be on the same economic level as zimbabwe

 

There's no doubt that our economy relies a lot on NYC, but it's not our whole economy, there are so many variables. Sure it would hurt us big time, but I'm not quite sure it would cripple us as bad as most would think. Just my opinion

It would only cripple us as much as we would let it. We are a pathetically panicky nation. We allowed 9/11 to hurt us for christ's sake. It would all be in our reaction, not in the reality of the situation.

Maybe not Zimbabwe, but it would cripple the world economy for a decade minimum.

 

actually it would take a decade for the us to turn into zimbabwe. people will at first underestimate the significance of what happened and down play it

 

 

There's no doubt that our economy relies a lot on NYC, but it's not our whole economy, there are so many variables. Sure it would hurt us big time, but I'm not quite sure it would cripple us as bad as most would think. Just my opinion

 

its not "our" economy (as in the united states) its the world. obviously if you dont feel that way great, ignorance is a bliss and sometimes the less you know and understand the easier it is to live life so more power to you

 

 

I find so many of the comments in this thread just plain ignorant and extremely arrogant. Not only did I expect more from some of you, it has actually upset me to think many of you have the same views.

 

The main reason I asked for the thread to be closed was simple. Watching videos like this, of life being extinguished seems to be like a sport for some people...Regardless of who is killing who...

If the government funded any technology to be created, it could have been done in the academic setting for a fraction of the cost. The government overpays so egregiously that it incentivises the contractor to deliver the goods that are barely sufficient. There is a reaosn why the phrase, "close enough for government work" came about. Any technology that came about through defense spending was a massive waste of money.

 

Bottom line, we could cut our spending next year in half and nothing would change on a safety level.

 

The reason why that phrase "close enough for government work" came about because of quality. Over the years that phrase evolved into what it means now. Coincidently it evolve with the expansion of government social programs.

 

So is your argument that the cost isn't worth it for safety, or for progress?

 

Historically the largest research grants at Stanford, Caltech, Cornell, MIT, and hundreds of other Engineering research schools stem from defense spending. And it wasn't just the hard sciences that benefited from this funding, including the natural and social sciences. The reason why here are so many areas of study at engineering schools is due to military funding the expansion of research during the cold war.

 

So we really can't say this research could be done at academic settings for a a fraction of the cost if its already being done at academic institutions. Even our beloved Lamborghini is doing research at the University of Washington. Guess who is a big funder of research there? Boeing. So when we all get our dream Lamborghini that utilizes advanced materials, we can thank the United States Military Industrial complex.

 

I find it amazing that in the most progress made in human history has also occured during the largest period of military funding.

 

 

Now, the issue with cost overruns in military spending stems from design changes. Although this isn't the single reason why, this is the most significant reason why programs end up costing so much. In most industries, once something is sent to be manufactured, nothing really drastic changes. Throughout the entire phase of development and manufacturing of military technology changes are made to the products specifications.

 

Finally, I would love to know what high level goods are deemed barely sufficient?

 

I find so many of the comments in this thread just plain ignorant and extremely arrogant. Not only did I expect more from some of you, it has actually upset me to think many of you have the same views.

 

The main reason I asked for the thread to be closed was simple. Watching videos like this, of life being extinguished seems to be like a sport for some people...Regardless of who is killing who...

 

I have the same views as those deemed ignorant and arrogant. I have them because I grew up with a friend, who was fatherless because his father was on Pan am 103. I have those views because on September 11th, I watched friends flown into the buildings my family worked in. So on behalf of those who are ignorant and arrogant, I don't apologize for how I feel.

I find so many of the comments in this thread just plain ignorant and extremely arrogant. Not only did I expect more from some of you, it has actually upset me to think many of you have the same views.

 

The main reason I asked for the thread to be closed was simple. Watching videos like this, of life being extinguished seems to be like a sport for some people...Regardless of who is killing who...

 

how can you have sympathy for some terrorist piece of shit? this isnt human life being extinguished this is animal life being extinguished. those assholes deserve to die, and die a slow and painful death. its just cheaper and less time consuming to spray them from a mile away from a chopper than it is to jail them and torture them

 

if it was up to me, id nuke em and start from scratch. rebuild the country and make iraq a dubai 2.0 built on oil. the country deserves to prosper and be successful but first the lack of a better word "people" who live there now need to be gone. either flea to another islamic state that wants to deal with them or level them.

 

the same goes for afganistan, they have natural resources just like iraq and both countries should prosper but not with the type of people that live there now. and even though my views may seem extreme, when your dealing with extreme people its the only way

Mkooley can you still edit your post?

I would do it quickly, that is the most retarded post I've ever red on LP., that crap might've worked 60 years ago in Germany but I thought we were done with that and the whole world learned something from it

 

 

i believe i read in another thread you owned/own a construction company by any chance were you contracted by the govn to work in ground zero?

 

Initially I went as a volunteer, then was contracted.

Mkooley can you still edit your post?

I would do it quickly, that is the most retarded post I've ever red on LP., that crap might've worked 60 years ago in Germany but I thought we were done with that and the whole world learned something from it

 

nope, wont edit it. lost friends in 9/11, have a friend that is still shooken and wont work in nyc as he gets panick attacks going into the city so he had to move to miami. lots of people are still hurting, everyday. lots of moms, dads, husbands and wives, friends, died because of some piece of shit terrorists. 9/11 almost made me enroll into the marines, almost...i wouldnt make it because im not built like that im a geek so not really good at taking orders but i thought about it allot and just came to the conclusion that someone better (like gang members) would be better fighting a war and killing scum

nope, wont edit it. lost friends in 9/11, have a friend that is still shooken and wont work in nyc as he gets panick attacks going into the city so he had to move to miami. lots of people are still hurting, everyday. lots of moms, dads, husbands and wives, friends, died because of some piece of shit terrorists. 9/11 almost made me enroll into the marines, almost...i wouldnt make it because im not built like that im a geek so not really good at taking orders but i thought about it allot and just came to the conclusion that someone better (like gang members) would be better fighting a war and killing scum

 

Congrats, you just outdid yourself in the stupid ass comments department with the "gang member..." bullshit. Best cease the remarks now, you're coming off like a complete douche

Initially I went as a volunteer, then was contracted.

 

i was at the time on the westcoast working and my boss wouldnt let me go on leave to volunteer. i think what you did was extremely important and for that i hold a higher respect for you.

Congrats, you just outdid yourself in the stupid ass comments department with the "gang member..." bullshit. Best cease the remarks now, you're coming off like a complete douche

 

 

 

 

 

how can you have sympathy for some terrorist piece of shit? this isnt human life being extinguished this is animal life being extinguished. those assholes deserve to die, and die a slow and painful death. its just cheaper and less time consuming to spray them from a mile away from a chopper than it is to jail them and torture them

 

if it was up to me, id nuke em and start from scratch. rebuild the country and make iraq a dubai 2.0 built on oil. the country deserves to prosper and be successful but first the lack of a better word "people" who live there now need to be gone. either flea to another islamic state that wants to deal with them or level them.

 

the same goes for afganistan, they have natural resources just like iraq and both countries should prosper but not with the type of people that live there now. and even though my views may seem extreme, when your dealing with extreme people its the only way

 

 

How long has it been since your last trip to Iraq or Afghanistan? A lot has changed in both countries in the last few years....

 

 

nope, wont edit it. lost friends in 9/11, have a friend that is still shooken [sic] and wont work in nyc as he gets panick [sic] attacks going into the city so he had to move to miami. lots of people are still hurting, everyday. lots of moms, dads, husbands and wives, friends, died because of some piece of shit terrorists.

 

9/11 almost made me enroll into the marines, almost...i wouldnt make it because im not built like that im a geek so not really good at taking orders

The United States Marine Corps would have resolved that problem for you.

 

but i thought about it allot and just came to the conclusion that someone better (like gang members) would be better fighting a war and killing scum

 

Yeah.... Youre going to want to explain this last statement as soon as possible....

I have the same views as those deemed ignorant and arrogant. I have them because I grew up with a friend, who was fatherless because his father was on Pan am 103. I have those views because on September 11th, I watched friends flown into the buildings my family worked in. So on behalf of those who are ignorant and arrogant, I don't apologize for how I feel.

 

I have no issues with loss nor do I endorse terrorism. I watched as 9/11 live as it happened. If you have lost loved ones then you have every right to feel the way you do. However my point is you cannot hold a Nation or Region responsible for the actions of a few.

 

I know many on this forum are from the Middle East or have family ties there. How do you think it makes them feel when fellow members here say they would rather see the Middle East flattened by a nuke? Who are we to decide the fate of millions of people? What gives us the right?

 

how can you have sympathy for some terrorist piece of shit? this isnt human life being extinguished this is animal life being extinguished. those assholes deserve to die, and die a slow and painful death. its just cheaper and less time consuming to spray them from a mile away from a chopper than it is to jail them and torture them

 

if it was up to me, id nuke em and start from scratch. rebuild the country and make iraq a dubai 2.0 built on oil. the country deserves to prosper and be successful but first the lack of a better word "people" who live there now need to be gone. either flea to another islamic state that wants to deal with them or level them.

 

the same goes for afganistan, they have natural resources just like iraq and both countries should prosper but not with the type of people that live there now. and even though my views may seem extreme, when your dealing with extreme people its the only way

 

Your response just shows the lack of respect you have for humanity. I could go into so much depth but I know it would be a wasted attempt at reason.

I have no issues with loss nor do I endorse terrorism. I watched as 9/11 live as it happened. If you have lost loved ones then you have every right to feel the way you do. However my point is you cannot hold a Nation or Region responsible for the actions of a few.

 

I know many on this forum are from the Middle East or have family ties there. How do you think it makes them feel when fellow members here say they would rather see the Middle East flattened by a nuke? Who are we to decide the fate of millions of people? What gives us the right?

 

I never said I hold an entire region, nor any specific nations responsible. However I don't feel bad when those who foster such people become casualties of war. Lie down with pigs and prepare to be slaughtered. If you harbor a fugitive in the United States you will get punished, why should those harboring terrorists be treated any different?

 

I hope those individuals are able to differentiate themselves from the scum shown in the video, if they cannot, well ponder that thought.

 

 

The answer to your question of "Who are we to decide the fate of millions of people" is we are the United States of America, and its allies. The most powerful country in the world, and its best friends. I think we have done a pretty fair job all things considered. Zero genocides, zero war crimes. We rebuild nations and ask for nothing in return. History tends to repeat itself. Who does a better job? (I'm also including the Australians, British, and Canadians in that statement)

 

This is what we do. Always.

 

U.S. Marines protecting an Afghan man and his son after some Taliban members opened fire in the town of Marjah.

A British soldier playing with children.

 

 

What amuses me is civilians who think they know all the details that our top leaders and commanders base their decisions on.......And thus form their own opinions about how we should spend our money and what the best decisions in war should be. Some of the ideas in here are very well thought out and I agree with many of the ideals, but I dont think there is a single person in here who truly knows better.

What amuses me is civilians who think they know all the details that our top leaders and commanders base their decisions on.......And thus form their own opinions about how we should spend our money and what the best decisions in war should be. Some of the ideas in here are very well thought out and I agree with many of the ideals, but I dont think there is a single person in here who truly knows better.

 

I have the same views as those deemed ignorant and arrogant. I have them because I grew up with a friend, who was fatherless because his father was on Pan am 103. I have those views because on September 11th, I watched friends flown into the buildings my family worked in. So on behalf of those who are ignorant and arrogant, I don't apologize for how I feel.

To base views on the aforementioned events is exactly what's wrong with the views.

 

how can you have sympathy for some terrorist piece of shit? this isnt human life being extinguished this is animal life being extinguished. those assholes deserve to die, and die a slow and painful death. its just cheaper and less time consuming to spray them from a mile away from a chopper than it is to jail them and torture them

 

if it was up to me, id nuke em and start from scratch. rebuild the country and make iraq a dubai 2.0 built on oil. the country deserves to prosper and be successful but first the lack of a better word "people" who live there now need to be gone. either flea to another islamic state that wants to deal with them or level them.

 

the same goes for afganistan, they have natural resources just like iraq and both countries should prosper but not with the type of people that live there now. and even though my views may seem extreme, when your dealing with extreme people its the only way

 

I don't know which is worse: your ignorance or your arrogance. You need a lot of help.

What amuses me is civilians who think they know all the details that our top leaders and commanders base their decisions on.......And thus form their own opinions about how we should spend our money and what the best decisions in war should be. Some of the ideas in here are very well thought out and I agree with many of the ideals, but I dont think there is a single person in here who truly knows better.

 

It's not about details, it's about big picture. I doubt there are many leaders or commanders on whose decisions I would rely for much of anything with big picture stuff.

The answer to your question of "Who are we to decide the fate of millions of people" is we are the United States of America, and its allies. The most powerful country in the world, and its best friends. I think we have done a pretty fair job all things considered. Zero genocides, zero war crimes. We rebuild nations and ask for nothing in return. History tends to repeat itself. Who does a better job? (I'm also including the Australians, British, and Canadians in that statement)

 

 

Power has no bearing on 'rightness'; it simply means it's the easiest for us to force our ideas on others. We have committed untold war crimes not to mention we imprisioned an entire race of people during WWII that most people born after 1980 have never heard about because we simply neglect to mention it in the history books.

 

We are as hypocritical as the Catholic Church. We were founded on the very ideals we break on a daily basis.