Middle East and North Africa

In the next few days...... I just have a feeling that Gadhafi is going to wind up exactly the same way that an earlier sovereign of Libya did.

Dead, dangling by his heels from a rope; Benito Mussolini redux.

Yes kuwait is better than most country's in the region, but if you think your free dye your hair pink, put a dress on, convert to christianity and try to buy an an AR-15 and then tell me how free you are. I'm not trying to pick a fight just trying to present a differnt point of view.

There's no rule here that prevent that but people will distance themselves from that person because that's against our culture

The only things that you can't do here are extreme things like walk out naked to bad mouth Islam or bad mouth the prince of Kuwait

And because Kuwait is Muslim country you can't drink alcohol here

Anything other than that's ok

There's no rule here that prevent that but people will distance themselves from that person because that's against our culture

The only things that you can't do here are extreme things like walk out naked to bad mouth Islam or bad mouth the prince of Kuwait

And because Kuwait is Muslim country you can't drink alcohol here

Anything other than that's ok

You know they are completely free... except for items like freedom of choice and freedom of speech.

You're there on the ground? Cool, cool, so give us some updates if you can, thanks.

 

"Confirmation" is not the same as "being whored out on the BBC as true, when there is no information beyond blogs reporting it".

 

There is NO confirmation on the ORIGINAL STORY we're talking about here, which is that Libyan Air Force jets bombed their own people and then fled to Malta.

 

None.

 

Your "200 people dead" has no bearing, that is a seperate story ALSO in need of CONFIRMATION.

 

It really is amazing how journalist standards have fallen, anyone under 30 just has no clue whatsoever on how to determine is something is real, or simply a story being repeated endlessly. I guess that really is the the Internet generation at play, all you have to do is post up theory and they take it as fact.

 

Nothing is true until it's confirmed. In this case, nothing is confirmed beyond "reports". If you listen CLOSELY as the journalists covering the story reports you'll hear the usual disclaimers like: "We're hearing..." "Unconfirmed sources say..." "Sources on the ground say..." etc.

 

Those are clues that official confirmation hasn't yet been given on a story. They're outs basically.

 

Our heart goes out to any family affected by this insane tyrant, that much is certain.

If you do not find sources like BBC, Reuters, NPR, AP and others like them credible, then there is no point I discussing this matter with you.

 

Journalist standards have not fallen, you just need to stop watching the entertainment news media.

 

I can't believe this guy actually wants to go down as a martyr...

 

 

Anyone know if an uprising like this could happen in Venezuela?

I can't believe this guy actually wants to go down as a martyr...

 

 

Anyone know if an uprising like this could happen in Venezuela?

it could happen, but as of right now it doesn't seem like these uprisings are inspiring anything in Venezuela at the moment

Completely unconfirmed, but some are saying Ghadaffi is ordering oil pipelines be blown up; think we could be in for a major oil shock maybe?

If you do not find sources like BBC, Reuters, NPR, AP and others like them credible, then there is no point I discussing this matter with you.

 

Journalist standards have not fallen, you just need to stop watching the entertainment news media.

 

Every source you quoted is saying the same thing I am, that their reports are "unconfirmed". It can't get much more clear than that.

 

Just because an agency runs a story, does NOT mean it's "credible". It simply means they are reporting an unconfirmed event, which they clearly label as such. They report it as rumor, which it is until it is officially confirmed.

 

The story about those jets that flew to Malta because they "didn't want to fire on their own people" is STILL unconfirmed at this point, and likely never will be.

 

Rumor only, just as it was a week ago. Hope this clears it up for you, you can learn a great deal from this thread.

 

As an example, this Libyan national newspaper is again saying today that two more pilots "refused to bomb protestors" and ejected from their planes today:

 

http://quryna.com/30837.html

 

Now just because this newspaper is run by pro-revolution factions, and very anti-Khadaffi, does NOT mean the story is biased or untrue. That's not what I'm saying.

 

BUT...Reuters, the BBC, and American news agencies are now running this paper's story as if it IS accurate and fact-based. Which means nothing. They are not "credible" just because they ran the small Libyan paper's accounting of the events. They are just repeating a rumor.

 

THAT is the difference.

Every source you quoted is saying the same thing I am, that their reports are "unconfirmed". It can't get much more clear than that.

 

Just because an agency runs a story, does NOT mean it's "credible". It simply means they are reporting an unconfirmed event, which they clearly label as such. They report it as rumor, which it is until it is officially confirmed.

 

The story about those jets that flew to Malta because they "didn't want to fire on their own people" is STILL unconfirmed at this point, and likely never will be.

 

Rumor only, just as it was a week ago. Hope this clears it up for you, you can learn a great deal from this thread.

 

As an example, this Libyan national newspaper is again saying today that two more pilots "refused to bomb protestors" and ejected from their planes today:

 

http://quryna.com/30837.html

 

Now just because this newspaper is run by pro-revolution factions, and very anti-Khadaffi, does NOT mean the story is biased or untrue. That's not what I'm saying.

 

BUT...Reuters, the BBC, and American news agencies are now running this paper's story as if it IS accurate and fact-based. Which means nothing. They are not "credible" just because they ran the small Libyan paper's accounting of the events. They are just repeating a rumor.

 

THAT is the difference.

Actually, as I mentioned in previous post, BBC's "WHYS" has had many people from Libya, who are Libyan citizens, in Libya as of right now, who confirmed such reports. Though no one mentioned Airforce dropping bombs; however, they did confirm planes firing into the crowd.

 

You can listen to Monday's broadcast if you want to hear from "someone on the ground"

 

Actually, as I mentioned in previous post, BBC's "WHYS" has had many people from Libya, who are Libyan citizens, in Libya as of right now, who confirmed such reports. Though no one mentioned Airforce dropping bombs; however, they did confirm planes firing into the crowd.

 

You can listen to Monday's broadcast if you want to hear from "someone on the ground"

 

And those Libyan citizens don't have an axe to grind with Khadaffi at all. Oh no, they would NEVER fabricate a story like that at all to sway world opinion via a microphone in their face. No way. They are paragons of virtue and bias-free analysis.

 

Confirmation is NOT simply two clowns in a town saying "yep, it happened".

 

It comes from the PILOT'S MOUTHS. Either from other pilots who refused to fire, or from the murderous pilots themselves. It does NOT come from some clowns throwing molotov cocktails at Khadaffi's tanks.

 

That's the difference between CONFIRMED, and your version of the word.

Here is the link to the Monday's archive.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/worldhaveyoursa...gad.html#284191

 

 

Here is the link to the Monday's archive.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/worldhaveyoursa...gad.html#284191

 

That is a great example of a well done piece. It's unconfirmed and not verfied in the least, but it's well-executed. Personally I feel it accurately protrays what is happening there, but that is just my opinion, similar to the opinions of the people they're quoting as sources.

 

It is not confirmed as fact by any means, and relies 100% on heresay from those that have a problem with the government, so it has to be taken lightly until confirmation by third parties who have no bias one way or the other.

 

Definitely sad for those people, hopefully they can make the change happen that they deserve.

And those Libyan citizens don't have an axe to grind with Khadaffi at all. Oh no, they would NEVER fabricate a story like that at all to sway world opinion via a microphone in their face. No way. They are paragons of virtue and bias-free analysis.

 

Confirmation is NOT simply two clowns in a town saying "yep, it happened".

 

It comes from the PILOT'S MOUTHS. Either from other pilots who refused to fire, or from the murderous pilots themselves. It does NOT come from some clowns throwing molotov cocktails at Khadaffi's tanks.

 

That's the difference between CONFIRMED, and your version of the word.

I don't think it's just 'one clown' stating that. Similar stories have been reported on major media outlets, blogs, via phone to programs like WHYS.

 

 

This conversation is reminding of that one quote from Tommy Boy...

"I can get a good look at a T-bone by sticking my head up a bull's ass, but I'd rather take a butcher's word for it.."

I don't think it's just 'one clown' stating that. Similar stories have been reported on major media outlets, blogs, via phone to programs like WHYS.

 

 

This conversation is reminding of that one quote from Tommy Boy...

"I can get a good look at a T-bone by sticking my head up a bull's ass, but I'd rather take a butcher's word for it.."

 

Bias is bias. We see what we WANT to see. Especially in life and death situations.

 

It doesn't matter if it's 1 clown, 100 clowns, or even 1000 clowns, a mob is a mob and they're going to move and act and report in unison with their version of events.

 

To be clear for those on the sideline I absolutely believe Khadaffi and his armed forces are killing innocents. But that is my OPINION based on heresay and third-party reports from extremely biased sources. Just as it is with the world's major media outlets.

 

Love that Tommy Boy quote.

Bias is bias. We see what we WANT to see. Especially in life and death situations.

 

It doesn't matter if it's 1 clown, 100 clowns, or even 1000 clowns, a mob is a mob and they're going to move and act and report in unison with their version of events.

 

To be clear for those on the sideline I absolutely believe Khadaffi and his armed forces are killing innocents. But that is my OPINION based on heresay and third-party reports from extremely biased sources. Just as it is with the world's major media outlets.

 

Love that Tommy Boy quote.

As of right now, journalists aren't allowed in that country, so we'll have to wait for the reports to be 'confirmed', but to be honest, if you look at Gaddafi's 40+ years of rule, he has been old of the most oppressive dictator, so I do take the Libyan citizens word for it.

 

 

I meant "one of the most oppressive dedicator in the region"

As of right now, journalists aren't allowed in that country, so we'll have to wait for the reports to be 'confirmed', but to be honest, if you look at Gaddafi's 40+ years of rule, he has been old of the most oppressive dictator, so I do take the Libyan citizens word for it.

 

Yep. Which is why my opinion is what it is. And I've clearly stated that opinion I believe multiple times now, including in the very post above your last one.

Oh BTW BBC just broadcast videos of Helicopter Gunship firing on the Libyan protesters.

 

 

Oh BTW BBC just broadcast videos of Helicopter Gunship firing on the Libyan protesters.

 

Good find, post the link up for us.

I happen to be watching BBC America broadcast, so it's on at the moment.

 

I can try to link you to their website, if you' like that?

I happen to be watching BBC America broadcast, so it's on at the moment.

 

I can try to link you to their website, if you' like that?

 

Definitely, that's huge

Really... it's a forum. Can't we speculate about this event... else there is no need to have this thread.

 

 

 

http://english.aljazeera.net/watch_now/

 

 

 

 

 

These are live witness reports and what not

 

http://twitter.com/shabablibya

 

http://twitter.com/feb17voices

'easy does it" - what are your thoughts on the endangered tree octopus?

 

Tree Octopus

'easy does it" - what are your thoughts on the endangered tree octopus?

 

Tree Octopus

 

Oh.... Shit... Under Israeli law, Gaddafi may be able to seek asylum in in Israel.... AS A JEW.