Just got back from Japan. America has issues...

There must be something in the culture that makes Japanese like torture and sadism. They were notorious for this in World War II. In the Rape of Nanking they say the Japanese outdid the Nazis in being terrible, which is pretty astounding considering Stalin's henchmen were terrible in Russia and the Nazis outdid them.

 

Japan has some of the wackiest game shows on the history of network tv. Some are outright sadistic, ruthless and crazy. If those were on North America tv, lawsuits will ensue 2 seconds after being on air, i.e. if it ever made it that far.

 

Japanese tv commercials, IMO, are the most entertaining. Some are so wacky that you have absolutely no idea on what they are selling until the last 2 seconds. And some are totally pointless; nothing but pure celebrity endorsement. I think I mentioned this before: they had a 15sec commercial where you see Arnold Schwarzenegger in a full deep sea diving suit holding a diving helmet standing tall. He slowly takes a big deep breath; that took 12seconds. Then on the last 3 seconds, a Cup of Noodles is displayed in full screen and that's it! No speech, just music background. Another one is Tommy Lee Jones in a profile shot; the camera pans and Jones' eye follow the lens. Then it switches scene with Jones drinking something in a can. Then it cuts into a big screen shot of the canned coffee.

 

I love nonsensical things like this!

How many Japanese do you know that like torture and sadism? I have family in Japan, many friends, I spent lots of time over there and have never met anyone who was into rape, sadism and torture, please stop generalizing.

 

I think this thread ran its course!

 

Fortis, not saying that Japanese people like torture and sadism as in they'd take pleasure in watching people be skinned alive or something. But during WWII, the Japanese did some of the most cruel and insanely inhumane torture in all the history of warfare (much of which they still refuse to acknowledge). Now part of this was the structure of the Japanese military. Every Japanese soldier treated horribly the soldiers of lower ranks, so the lowest-ranking soldiers then treated civilians horribly as well. So my thinking in my statement there was that if the Japanese culture takes pleasure in mild forms of sadism such as in certain game shows for example, then it isn't a huge step to see how the Japanese were so torturous during WWII. That would be what happens when this cultural aspect is allowed to go to an extreme.

Wheels, let's just leave it as is.

 

This is getting volatile, political, borderline racist and some had already been offended. It would not be fair for you or anyone to advocate for or against any country/culture without being physically there before and it would take more than 2 or 3 trips to fully understand. Reading off the internet and/or whatever media is not sufficient as most are one-sided coverages anyway; remember the old say: bad news sells papers. No one with a sane mind would ever condone the atrocious war crimes that the Japanese Imperial Army or the Nazi had done. But let's be realistic, no country would treat any POW with top courtesy either. By definition, it's called a war for obvious reasons. Aside from a movie script, most things occurred in a war would not be pretty. Even a small inner circle of school kids will have a clown, an intellect and a jerk; if that applies on a microscopic scale, imagine that on a macroscopic one. Every country will have its glory and its shady pass. Let's not be stereotypically judgmental especially when it's based on war atrocities. On the tv shows, ever considered those as one way to get a higher rating? There is a huge difference between game show wackiness and war crimes. Comparatively, are any of the trash shows like Jerry Springer et al, the farcical court room shows and those "real whatever of wherever" reality shows any better? Have you ever seen the US tv game show, Total Blackout? How's that different from torture and/or sadism?

 

Take this into account: Japan's total population is about 40% of the US' total. Yet the total area of Japan as a whole is less than that of California's alone (just a tad under 90% of CA's total area). Add this to a completely different culture: history, education, upbringing, etc... and it is obvious; we have two very different worlds/societies. The Japanese have to almost literally fight to survive with so many people packed in such a relatively small land mass. They simply need to keep reinventing themselves to stay alive and competitive within their own domestic market let alone the international one. The US had offered a huge helping hand to Japan. I concur that the US can learn something from Japan as well: public transit in terms of the efficient and effective railway network; and the Japanese auto industry likely (though inadvertently) helped and continue to help the US auto industry to improve. At the end of the day, no one is distinctively superior; rather, they complement each other.

 

America has issues, no doubt. But I think Japan has more negative issues than the US. Just look at how many Prime Ministers they had gone through in the last 8 years. The problem with North Americans visiting Japan is they are immediately shocked by a sensory overload because everything is so different and yet so orderly. Ever thought that it has to be that way due to culture and survival or else it would be an absolute chaos. I often say to my friends, we (as North Americans) can never tell the economic state that Japan is in because a very slow day in Japan will still look better than a very busy day in North America because there are so many people over there and people simply needs to consume. In fact, I can imagine the absolute frenzy that Japan will be in just about 4 hours from now --- this being the final day of the current fiscal year. As afore-said, on April 1, 2014, the Consumption Tax will rise from the current 5% to 8%. Think about the last minute rush to get those items, especially the higher end more expensive ones; and then think about what happens in the next 6 weeks.

 

Anyway, different strokes and everyone, every ethnicity and every nation have its pros and cons. We all live on this Earth as there are no other alternatives. We all can learn and benefit from each other. It's most likely fair to say that the majority of us on L/P live in first world countries and can enjoy the freedom of travelling to many places without additional visas. So enjoy the travels (ok, flying isn't the funnest part) and enjoy the different cultures. Be grateful on what we are able to indulge on.

VCR excellent post, thank you for the time you took writing it!

VCR excellent post, thank you for the time you took writing it!

 

Wheels, let's just leave it as is.

 

This is getting volatile, political, borderline racist and some had already been offended. It would not be fair for you or anyone to advocate for or against any country/culture without being physically there before and it would take more than 2 or 3 trips to fully understand. Reading off the internet and/or whatever media is not sufficient as most are one-sided coverages anyway; remember the old say: bad news sells papers.

 

I want to be clear though, I was not advocating for or against the Japanese culture, I was making an observation. Also, nothing I have said is racist. I think some confuse critiquing a culture with being racism. The two are not one and the same. If Japan was Japan, but filled with Caucasians as the primary ethnicity, I would have made the exact same statement I made.

 

Racist would be if I claimed that there must be something inherent to the Japanese ethnicity that makes them a certain way, which is not what I was saying, nor do I believe. I am sorry if any took my comments that way.

 

No one with a sane mind would ever condone the atrocious war crimes that the Japanese Imperial Army or the Nazi had done. But let's be realistic, no country would treat any POW with top courtesy either. By definition, it's called a war for obvious reasons.

 

Yes, but not all countries will horribly treat a POW either. Figure it this way, if you were to be captured in WWII, would you rather be captured by the Allies or by either the Nazis or the Imperial Japanese? Also, the Japanese and Nazi war crimes were not just against POWs but against civilian populations period in terms of what they would do (both tried to eliminate and destroy what they saw as inferior ethnicities).

 

Aside from a movie script, most things occurred in a war would not be pretty. Even a small inner circle of school kids will have a clown, an intellect and a jerk; if that applies on a microscopic scale, imagine that on a macroscopic one. Every country will have its glory and its shady pass. Let's not be stereotypically judgmental especially when it's based on war atrocities. On the tv shows, ever considered those as one way to get a higher rating? There is a huge difference between game show wackiness and war crimes. Comparatively, are any of the trash shows like Jerry Springer et al, the farcical court room shows and those "real whatever of wherever" reality shows any better? Have you ever seen the US tv game show, Total Blackout? How's that different from torture and/or sadism?

 

Have not seen Total Blackout. I agree that TV shows do things for higher ratings, but if a certain type of TV show is accepted in a culture, then there is something in the culture that leads people to like the TV show was my point. I also agree that much of U.S. TV does not reflect well at all on U.S. culture.

 

Anyway, different strokes and everyone, every ethnicity and every nation have its pros and cons. We all live on this Earth as there are no other alternatives. We all can learn and benefit from each other. It's most likely fair to say that the majority of us on L/P live in first world countries and can enjoy the freedom of travelling to many places without additional visas. So enjoy the travels (ok, flying isn't the funnest part) and enjoy the different cultures. Be grateful on what we are able to indulge on.

 

I agree!

Wheels, I'll say it again. Just leave it as it is otherwise you are quickly turning into the next Brian Wilson UK. Your logic, at times, is questionable. Imperial Japan and Nazi Germany lost the war and their war crimes were exposed at an international tribunal. The key word here is "exposed". Would anyone want or care to expose the wrong-doing of those who won the war? Cases in point, what did the vast majority of civilians in Hiroshima or Nagasaki do; how did they attributed to the war? Ever heard of Vietnam? And I don't think one needs to travel very far in the Middle East to hear both sides of the stories about the Western world. Don't believe in everything that you have read especially from today's media when sensationalism has a much higher priority than impartial coverage.

 

You are arguing on something that you have read or fed. That is a very slippery slope. Nothing beats personal experiences and exposures. Find the time to travel; doesn't matter where; it will really open up your mind and change your perspective of the world. Don't get too hung up on semantics; I guarantee you that it won't do you much good.

Wheels, I'll say it again. Just leave it as it is otherwise you are quickly turning into the next Brian Wilson UK. Your logic, at times, is questionable. Imperial Japan and Nazi Germany lost the war and their war crimes were exposed at an international tribunal. The key word here is "exposed". Would anyone want or care to expose the wrong-doing of those who won the war? Cases in point, what did the vast majority of civilians in Hiroshima or Nagasaki do; how did they attributed to the war? Ever heard of Vietnam? And I don't think one needs to travel very far in the Middle East to hear both sides of the stories about the Western world. Don't believe in everything that you have read especially from today's media when sensationalism has a much higher priority than impartial coverage.

 

You are arguing on something that you have read or fed. That is a very slippery slope. Nothing beats personal experiences and exposures. Find the time to travel; doesn't matter where; it will really open up your mind and change your perspective of the world. Don't get too hung up on semantics; I guarantee you that it won't do you much good.

 

Curious what Hiroshima or Nagasaki have to do with this discussion (not trying to be snarky but genuinely curious of the Japanese view point)? I am with you on the rest of your points.

 

Wheels I think this kind of discussion is better held face to face over a beer then in an online forum (I know I just broke my own advice above). Too much gets lost in translation!

Wheels, I'll say it again. Just leave it as it is otherwise you are quickly turning into the next Brian Wilson UK. Your logic, at times, is questionable. Imperial Japan and Nazi Germany lost the war and their war crimes were exposed at an international tribunal. The key word here is "exposed". Would anyone want or care to expose the wrong-doing of those who won the war? Cases in point, what did the vast majority of civilians in Hiroshima or Nagasaki do; how did they attributed to the war? Ever heard of Vietnam? And I don't think one needs to travel very far in the Middle East to hear both sides of the stories about the Western world. Don't believe in everything that you have read especially from today's media when sensationalism has a much higher priority than impartial coverage.

 

VCR I agree with your points about traveling more to better understand cultures, but I disagree with some of your historical points.

 

Many academics have made a career out of exposing the wrongdoings of the U.S. and U.K. historically. Those are well-known. The political Left historically have had no problem doing that. Also I think you are making a moral equivalency between those who won the war and those who didn't when there isn't one. Both the Nazis and the Japanese were bent on destroying entire cultures. The Nazis for example had a game where they would toss infant babies up into the air and then shoot them. There is a reason why the Russian population turned on the Nazis the way they did. The Imperial Japanese were similar in how they treated Korea and China. The Allies in World War II killed many civilians through things like bombing, true, but that's because they were fighting to stop the Nazis and Imperial Japanese. They did not do the other things that the Nazis and Imperial Japanese did.

 

You mentioned the atomic bombs. Well the conventional bombings of some German cities (such as Dresden) killed more people then the atomic bombs each did. Also, the use of the atomic bombs was because it was believed that the only way to get the Japanese to surrender otherwise was via a formal invasion, which it was calculated would entail greater loss of life. The U.S. also did not know about the effects of radiation at the time in their use of the bombs. Even then, they were used reluctantly by Truman and when Macarthur requested their use in the Korean War, Truman refused. Vietnam was about stopping communists, not oppressing anybody. But that's a whole different thread unto itself.

Can we just stop for a moment and be happy that game show's like this are allowed to exist over there? :lol2:

 

Japan makes great cars, but terrible at porn. American makes great porn, terrible at making cars.

 

 

Curious what Hiroshima or Nagasaki have to do with this discussion (not trying to be snarky but genuinely curious of the Japanese view point)? I am with you on the rest of your points.

 

 

No worries, nothing snarky at all. In fact, Hiroshima and Nagasaki have everything to do about this discussion. It was due to the bombings and along with US occupation that the aid poured to assist Japan. The Japanese learned and built most of what modern Japan is from the US. As afore-said, the Japanese took it to the next level by studying everything to the max. Its own patriotism and domestic consumption kick started the economy and, again with the assistance of the US, advanced to the global export stage. The US provided most, if not all, of the know-how. The 2 major post-war events that assisted Japan into the world stage were the 1964 Olympics in Tokyo and the 1970 World Expo in Osaka. Aside from entering the world arena, literally and economically, huge advancement on the infrastructure of Tokyo was made in terms of public transportation. Other Japanese cities followed the same advancement. Expo 70 gave rise to the now world-renowned Shinkansen Express or better known as the bullet train. Japan needs a mass public transit system between Tokyo and the then lesser city Osaka. So they started a brand new train system with dedicated tracks etc... so that the world would land in Tokyo and then take the train to Osaka. The rest was history. Let it also be known that originally, during the US occupation, the Zaibatsu, or industrial conglomerates, were to be dissolved. But the US back tracked a bit and instead re-industrialized Japan as a show piece to counter the rising communism in other parts of Asia. So today, you still have Mitsubishi, Sumitomo, Mitsui etc... that still form and control the majority of the Japan's economy and they also own some major industries and real estates in the world. All of these were the results from the atomic bombings that "ended" the war and how the US gave rise to Japan.

 

 

 

Wheels, thanks for the history lessons. I think many of us here have a much better understanding on what the actual circumstances were. But if that's your provocative, no problem on my part and best of luck to you.

Can we just stop for a moment and be happy that game show's like this are allowed to exist over there? :lol2:

 

The Japanese needs some twisted humour to balance their long working hours. Honestly, what they call "variety shows" and commercials on their tv are some of the most entertaining stuff on the tube.

 

Japan makes great cars, but terrible at porn. American makes great porn, terrible at making cars.

 

I guess you do have a point there...I think.

 

Wheels, thanks for the history lessons. I think many of us here have a much better understanding on what the actual circumstances were. But if that's your provocative, no problem on my part and best of luck to you.

 

Coolbeans VCR, thank you for the advice and information on things.

VCR, you have the patience of a saint. I started writing a post earlier today, but it quickly devolved into a mess comparing Honey Boo Boo to tentacle porn. I then took a walk.

 

Now I feel better.

comparing Honey Boo Boo to tentacle porn

 

 

Man, thats so disturbing lol

Can we just stop for a moment and be happy that game show's like this are allowed to exist over there? :lol2:

 

 

That is hilarious!

Man, thats so disturbing lol

Yep. I may have nightmares.

Yep. I may have nightmares.

 

Too many holes and just one penis lol

Too many holes and just one penis lol

 

You're just going to have to pick your poison.

You're just going to have to pick your poison.

 

Yup

Can we just stop for a moment and be happy that game show's like this are allowed to exist over there? :lol2:

 

 

LOL at the guy in the end!

 

Also, VCR, you should get a standing ovation and a salute for your excellent replies

Nothing beats personal experiences and exposures. Find the time to travel; doesn't matter where; it will really open up your mind and change your perspective of the world. Don't get too hung up on semantics; I guarantee you that it won't do you much good.

 

This is very true. And as you said, it takes more than a few short trips to really wrap your head around things (culture, government, work, etc) in another country. I feel the same way about Italy that you do about Japan. America has its issues, but some of the bureaucratic bullshit that I dealt with when I lived in Italy, as well as seeing how strong organized crime still is (at least in the south), really made me look twice at how things are here. There were definitely somethings that I took away from Italian living and have incorporated into my life back here in the States though.