Minister Of Defense, Canada - Aliens

Maybe read my post again... When did I call anyone stupid? Thats what I thought... Saying "Haha" does not mean I am laughing at him as I was laughing at the fact how he explained Paul as being old and losing his mind many years ago and how old people with his experience all seem to get weird... I found that funny. Paul did give creditable evidence on all his "opinions".

Ok, that's my bad. I will admit, I could have probably done a better job looking at it. Then again, I was responding to your one post, so I have left myself out of the rest of the conversation (and that likely is also another issue, I am bad at that sometimes.) I suppose it came across the way I read it that you were laughing at his post as if he made no sense. I know RomanDad is old as shit now, at least 80 years old and he's just falling apart at the seams though, poor guy.

 

It's sometimes difficult to understand the intentions of people's posts at times. I have some social issues that make it difficult for me to understand things at times. Sometimes reading things online is a huge challenge for me since I do not always understand what people are trying to say and have to go with my best guess, often times, I end up offending. I don't do these things on purpose and it ends up being a struggle for me. In this case, the rest of your post comes across as incredibly offended, though it wasn't my intention to offend you to an incredible degree (well, not intended to offend at all, really).

 

My primary point is that it's ok to be skeptical and still entertain ideas without sacrificing your ability to think widely and end up simply take people at their word on things. Being open minded is about being able to entertain ideas, wear them like a hat, though you do not need to wear the hat 24/7.

 

Disrespectful and unable to converse with Roman makes absolutely no sense as when I replied to both his posts, I clearly stated I can understand his doubt and see why he would think these people have lost their mind, and in my second response to him I said I understand how he can be skeptical as I am with some things as well... This my friend is called "understanding and open minded"

 

Maybe stop starting shit out of thin air with accusing me of calling people stupid and being narrow minded when this thread has been a good discussion to anyone that has the ability to read my posts and others rather than judge them based on accusations of being rude, disrespectful and my favorite comment of yours... "doesn't make you sound open minded"

Again, it's the way I read your post. It made it sound as if you were saying, "Haha, i don't like your opinion and he has nothing but facts, try again... *insert wa wa wa button*"

 

Opposite of open minded is narrow minded with the definition of narrow minded meaning to have a narrow outlook... Completely opposite of every post of mine in this thread as I have shown to be completely open minded. It is completely normal to have a discussion even when people have different views or outlooks... These things tend to happen on public forums...

I certainly don't disagree with you that people enjoy having discussion, debates, etc on public forums. Keep in mind, I was only addressing your first post, not the rest of the posts in this thread.

 

Now narrow minded and not being able to have a discussion is more in your post than any, especially with the fact of all your questions have been answered by Paul in the news interview. They do seem logical to me.

I listened to the interview, but he made a lot of statements. It left me with a lot more questions. For instance, the news reporter says, "Have you seen them?" and he replied well... no, but I know people who xyz, abc and so on. Then stated things like, "Well the airforce is working with them." but gave no citations as to how anyone can confirm such things.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm open to the idea of this stuff. But it seems difficult to take someone's word for it when they say so, without any citations that can be used that any of us have access to, can see for ourselves, or are asserted to just "take their word for it."

 

Ever heard of an Einstein-Rosen bridge theory What does that crazy cook know with his 160 IQ and the changes he brought to this world... To you it is much more of a mathematical probability that we are the only living intelligent life form based on your opinion and a few others with the fact that it is such a cold and harsh living environment out in space and we could not possibly be in reach to them and thus your theory of intelligent life being statically low and likely due to the fact that you think that there is no other forms of travel in space.

In all fairness, Isaac Newton believed in alchemy. What does that crazy cook know? I mean, he believed in alchemy therefore alchemy must be plausible, no?

 

Again, arguing from authority doesn't necessarily make something true unless the person has something specific to address and it can be confirmed. Just because someone is smart, doesn't mean that they are immune to wishful thinking. Isaac newton decided to come up with calculus for crying outloud, the reflecting telescope, universal gravitation, etc... but he still believed in alchemy and crazy hidden mathematical secret languages in the bible.

 

Now, I'm not dismissing the Einstein-Rosen bridge theory. In fact, it's possible that it could be the case that wormholes are a possibility. I mean, we just recently discovered that matter in small particles can actually be transported from A to B, which is pretty rad. Not that we can do anything larger than small particles for now. If that ends up being the case, then sure, it's likely that it exists. However, I forsee you jumping to the, "Einstein-Rosen bridge theory exists, therefore aliens can travel anywhere" but again, aren't we still making jumps from A to G instead of A to B here? Still doesn't address why only anecdotal accounts and "governments working with them" are the case.

 

As well, I never said that by mathematical probability that are the only possible race living in here. I posted up the drake equation to get a simple idea of possibilities. Keep in mind, that only addresses our galaxy. Our galaxy is one of billions. As I said, bring those numbers up enough and it's far more than likely that someone has won the cosmic lottery. More than once, and probably not just us.

 

But you didn't address or talk about why you feel there would be so many potential species being so advanced...

- Wouldn't they be subject to the same stresses as our civilization?

- Wouldn't they replicate, go through or end up dealing with the same trials and tribulations we did? Climate change, odd lines of thinking, war, famine, disease

- Wouldn't those civilizations have to overcome that before they were mature enough to become a space traveling race?

- How many of those would potentially snuff themselves out before they hit that point?

 

This to me seems narrow minded my friend. I am not pretending to know everything, far from it. But the evident difference between me and you is that you seem to base your opinion more on "I will believe it when I see it" instead of being open minded with the fact that we know absolutely nothing of what is out there. This is as narrow minded and self centered as your thoughts and opinions can be.

Mmm, no, not completely. It isn't that I'll believe it when I see it. As I said, I'm somewhere between skeptical and it's possible, and "i'll believe it when I see it."

 

Narrow minded would be, "It's not possible. (incapable of entertaining ideas) That's a stupid idea (inability to ascertain possibilities) and you're a conspiracy theorist for believing in that stuff.(jumping to conclusions without analysing your post)" (which I'm sure you've got from time to time when talking about it, no?)

 

My point was essentially that while it is possible and mathematically probable that other life is out there, that simply leaping to conclusions or making mental bridges to believe the stories of those who want to believe, it doesn't necessarily make it true.

 

Why is it all of the potential races people come up with ideas for end up being specifically humanoid races? Doesn't that seem oddly coincidental? Look at dolphins. Intelligent creatures, live in the sea, swim, smart as hell. Imagine life evolving on another planet that perhaps is made up of entirely different material. What if instead of dna, self replicating molecules ended up being of different matter. Or what if instead of 2 leg bipeds, they end up being something different due to the environmental variables? For instance, what if they breathe a different atmosphere than us? These would surely all factor in to how they look, etc. Why would an alien need giant eyes, why would they need to be incredibly tall, why would some be short but look similar, etc... these are all biological questions I would be asking because it seems like stuff people make up, but at the same time if there is an explanation it might be vastly interesting.

 

The oldest foundation of narrow minded people, the church, who use to burn people at the stake for thinking differently and apposing the church have now come out with the leader, that would be the pope, announcing that if aliens were to be discovered, that would not discredit the fact that there is a god... Think about how long of a way we have came if this has happened.

I certainly can't disagree with you there. We have come a long way in accepting new ideas and entertaining ideas. Thankfully, people aren't being burned at the stake or stoned to death (Unless you live in a certain part of the world) but we have freedom to be open minded in first world places. That is progress. Now if we could just stop killing each other over frivilous things, yeah?

 

Also one final thought with regards to the universe and not being to comprehend its vast size. Think of your dog or cat... To them, the world is your house and maybe a block or two around your neighborhood. How could you possible explain to them the size of the city you live in, or the country, or how big the world is... You cannot as their minds are unable to comprehend it. Maybe we are not too far apart with them and the fact that we cannot comprehend that their could be even more dimensions on our planet, let alone other ways to travel in space and the possibility of a lot of highly ranked individuals stating as fact that aliens have and do visit this planet.

I do astronomy by hobby and spend a ton of my time outside at night looking at the night sky as well as taking pictures of it. You and I are probably more alike from the ideas you have than you may think. I find the universe to be an incredibly personal reflection. Understanding how long it took a single photon to reach my eye from a nearby galaxy that I've taken a photo of and then understanding that the atoms in my body are composed of the same atoms from stars at one point, as well as the fact that we've all come from a singular infinitesimal area at one point in time is a profound realization that you are the universe looking upon itself. TO consider how huge it is, it is indeed humbling.

 

This is why we cannot explain a lot of our history when it comes to the Sumerians and how the Egyptians were able to do what they did along with the Mayans and so on.

People seem much too concerned with taking authority as the truth rather than truth as the authority with many aspects to modern day society. If it aint on the television, it isn't true or possible huh?

 

I hardly watch TV or the news. I find most of it biased. I prefer neutral reporting (which is hard to find these days) and the ability to dig through information and understand it. There is 2 sides to every story and unfortunately to actually find that in the news, you have to do an awful lot of digging in the 21st century.

 

While I find figures of authority convincing in aspects, we have to always remind ourselves that all people, IQ of 16 or 160 are all at the mercy of the same brain structure and potential logical fallacies. As I said, even newton himself, who was younger than I was when he came up with calculus and various other inventions and understandings of the universe, still had his fair share of wishful thinking.

 

Again, I'm not discounting all the possibilities you're speaking of, but what I am saying is that it is ok to be skeptical.

 

Skepticism is an approach to claims.

Science is a method to understanding.

 

I hope my reply is a bit more clear, and I am sorry if I came off as an asshole. Again, I have some social challenges that make my interaction with people difficult at times, although I don't really want to get into that.

Usually I am an avid reader but this time it's too much to read this topic.

Call me back when you get to the conclusion. Tnx bye!

Usually I am an avid reader but this time it's too much to read this topic.

Call me back when you get to the conclusion. Tnx bye!

 

The conclusion is: your avatar analy raped Canadas former defense minister.

The conclusion is: your avatar analy raped Canadas former defense minister.

 

I concede. This was the entire point we all were getting to. RomanDad strikes again.

Lets take this in another direction (because it segues into what I, and a lot of other folks who understand the US government believe).

 

Why? If aliens are visiting earth, why would the government hide that fact, but not prevent the discemination of the theory into the popular culture? And dont give me the. "To avoid a panic" bullshit.... I see zero indication, at this point, if Obama came out and said, "aliens have been visiting us, here is there spaceship , and meet ambasador squidhead...." That there would be any type of panic. Not to mention, the government fcuking loves it when the people is paniced. It gives them an excuse to do what they love most. Spend money on problems they cant fix.

 

If its, "but they would be pressured to protect the people and they cant so they dont admit it". Ok. Then why let the "theories" out there at all? You dont think the government could have shut up Art Bell thirty years ago? Or kept hollywood from popularizing sci-fi? The government has never done anything other than encourage these theories. To me that screams "then thats not what theyre hiding". If youre trying to keep a secret in plain sight nothing works better than to condition people to jump to a particular (incorrect) conclusion when they see an unfamiliar object in the sky.

 

I dont think a weather balloon crashed at Roswell. I dont think a space ship did either. I know a modern review of the contemporaneous reports on what crashed becomes a lot less spooky, as the materials reported are things we see all the time in our modern lives. And no. I dont think we stole Mylar or velcro from aliens.

Thanks for the video! I will definitely watch it tomorrow night!

 

Have you seen any of the Zeitgeists?

 

Number 1 is about Religion, Sept 9/11 and Money/Currency.

 

I really enjoyed number 3 as it is on human nature and such.

 

 

Here is #3. Everyone here should just watch the first few minutes, its really interesting.

 

 

I like it! Especially the beginning. I feel very near of what it says because i work in a bank and everyday i see people that make me think "will my life be sad like that in the future?".

 

I don't mind of what's real or not. I love mistery, unknown things and everything that is out of normality. If i would be rich, i would spend part of my money to travel the world understanding it and live those kind of mistery facs in person because often the media change the truth.

 

I spend a lot of time watching documentary about science and other stuff, i'm in love with stories of people like Leonardo Da Vinci and Nikola Tesla that changed the world just trying to understand it even if other people called them stupids.

 

Every discover is the result of people who didn't believe it. So, you can believe or not in aliens. But i think that both kind of people must be informed, the 1st to understand better what they want to know, the second to enforce their thoughhts. Too much people say "i'm not informed about extraterrestrial life because it doesn't exists" but few people say "i have read a lot about that and i do not agree with some points". There is a thing than surprised me. Some years ago, the UK wanted to investigate about UFOs so they nomined Nick Pope as Ministry of Defence investigator.When he started his job, he was skepticL but theninvestigation by investigation he started to believe it.

 

Lets take this in another direction (because it segues into what I, and a lot of other folks who understand the US government believe).

 

Why? If aliens are visiting earth, why would the government hide that fact, but not prevent the discemination of the theory into the popular culture? And dont give me the. "To avoid a panic" bullshit.... I see zero indication, at this point, if Obama came out and said, "aliens have been visiting us, here is there spaceship , and meet ambasador squidhead...." That there would be any type of panic. Not to mention, the government fcuking loves it when the people is paniced. It gives them an excuse to do what they love most. Spend money on problems they cant fix.

 

If its, "but they would be pressured to protect the people and they cant so they dont admit it". Ok. Then why let the "theories" out there at all? You dont think the government could have shut up Art Bell thirty years ago? Or kept hollywood from popularizing sci-fi? The government has never done anything other than encourage these theories. To me that screams "then thats not what theyre hiding". If youre trying to keep a secret in plain sight nothing works better than to condition people to jump to a particular (incorrect) conclusion when they see an unfamiliar object in the sky.

 

I dont think a weather balloon crashed at Roswell. I dont think a space ship did either. I know a modern review of the contemporaneous reports on what crashed becomes a lot less spooky, as the materials reported are things we see all the time in our modern lives. And no. I dont think we stole Mylar or velcro from aliens.

 

Glad you are still entering this thread as I thoroughly enjoy discussing these topics with you and the other gents that comment.

 

The oldest known civilization that had a lot of modern traits we do today such as education, writing, agriculture and so on were the Sumerians. They basically appeared out of nowhere with prior species not being anywhere near the same intellect with documented history. This was about 3500BC. We can't explain where they came from or how they were able to be as further advance as prior humans. Can't argue this is very interesting.

 

Also we cannot argue how interesting the Egyptians were who followed and how they were able to build the pyramids in the perfect architectural design with such heavy stones back in a time with no technology. The theory of the humongous stones being pushed on bamboo type branches and built from the ground up while building upwards and starting from the outside and working towards the inside have been proven wrong. There are no traces found of any sort of fire that would be needed to see in the dark for this build process. Many modern day architects swear that we would have an incredibly hard time even today to duplicate the pyramids with such precision and use of huge, heavy rocks.

 

The reason I mention this is because we live in a world with a lot of uncertainty my friend. We do not have answers to the most basic questions. Where do we come from, why are we here, what is the point to life, where do we go after we die...

 

Not sure how politically informed or even interested you are in today's world but it would be very hard to deny that those politicians we put in place clearly work on their own agendas and a lot have ulterior motives. Those famous presidents would be Reagan, Clinton, the Bushes and so forth. It is clear what they have to gain by being in power with the companies they are/were involved in and the reasoning behind their actions while under control of the US.

 

Not sure how much you know about the CIA, FBI, NSA and so forth and how they really are rogue agencies out with their own agendas as well. Look what happened to Kennedy when he wanted to shut down the CIA...

 

So with all that has happened and is going on in today's world by not just our present and previous leaders, but the Hussein's, Putin's, Castor's of the world, you cannot say that we are being lead by the most noble, trustworthy and deserving leaders who only have our best interest at heart.

 

I can think of many reasons why we would be lied to as we have been lied to for a very long time in regards to a lot more than just aliens.

 

You ask why the leaders would lie to us, I ask you why would they all of a sudden stop lying to us?

 

Doesn't it make you think how the hell we have come sooo far in regards to technology and other modern day advances in only the last 100+ years when we have been around for 6000-10,000+ years? When America dropped the Atomic bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, scientists say that even to this day the echo of such energy can be heard throughout the universe. This is an easily plausible explanation of why we have been seeing and documenting UFO sightings and even more crazier, how we have come so far since the 1940's as well in regards to modern day advances.

 

If you look into the Roswell crash, many former employees have said this was the first sighting of the circuit boards and other fascinating things.

The oldest known civilization that had a lot of modern traits we do today such as education, writing, agriculture and so on were the Sumerians. They basically appeared out of nowhere with prior species not being anywhere near the same intellect with documented history. This was about 3500BC. We can't explain where they came from or how they were able to be as further advance as prior humans. Can't argue this is very interesting.

 

Not really. Very little survives from that long ago, it's doubtful much of what we build today will be standing in 5500 years.

But here in Britain, we have evidence of earthworks, wooden and monolithic construction, mining, trade, roads, spirituality and jewelry-making going even further back than that. There are examples of primitive writing in the Middle East appearing quite a bit before the flourishing of Sumerian culture. The earliest known agriculture is from 10,000 years ago, with stone architecture around this time. Metallurgy goes back around 7000 years. Weaving, forestry, sculpture, hut building and animal domestication go back tens of thousands of years.

And the basic underpinning of it all, education and tool-making, is widespread among higher primates.

 

The point being, the progression of the technologies and principles that underpin civilisation go back a LONG way, and in a visible progression, even though the surviving evidence is so sparse. There's no need to suggest that any non-human entity gave us a shove along the way, the evidence is there that we worked it out, piece-by-piece, for ourselves.

 

Same goes for the technology of the 20th century, which by and large is a linear progression of advancements stemming from the industrial revolution, education reformation during the Renaissance and our innate curiosity.

 

Not sure how politically informed or even interested you are in today's world ...

 

Not sure how much you know about the CIA, FBI, NSA and so forth

 

 

 

Really?

 

 

 

Not sure how politically informed or even interested you are in today's world....

 

Not sure how much you know about the CIA, FBI, NSA and so forth

 

 

Seriously?

Not sure how politically informed or even interested you are in today's world...

 

Not sure how much you know about the CIA, FBI, NSA and so forth

 

 

You're kidding me... right?

You're kidding me... right?

 

Ummm some people could care less about politics. It wasnt meant to be a ignorant statement or question...

Not really. Very little survives from that long ago, it's doubtful much of what we build today will be standing in 5500 years.

But here in Britain, we have evidence of earthworks, wooden and monolithic construction, mining, trade, roads, spirituality and jewelry-making going even further back than that. There are examples of primitive writing in the Middle East appearing quite a bit before the flourishing of Sumerian culture. The earliest known agriculture is from 10,000 years ago, with stone architecture around this time. Metallurgy goes back around 7000 years. Weaving, forestry, sculpture, hut building and animal domestication go back tens of thousands of years.

And the basic underpinning of it all, education and tool-making, is widespread among higher primates.

 

The point being, the progression of the technologies and principles that underpin civilisation go back a LONG way, and in a visible progression, even though the surviving evidence is so sparse. There's no need to suggest that any non-human entity gave us a shove along the way, the evidence is there that we worked it out, piece-by-piece, for ourselves.

 

Same goes for the technology of the 20th century, which by and large is a linear progression of advancements stemming from the industrial revolution, education reformation during the Renaissance and our innate curiosity.

 

Agree to disagree on this one. I do agree that there is evidence of primitive writing and trade and jewelry from before the Sumerians but please do share a documented civilization with a superior society above the hut building and animal hunting tradition that has more evidence than just the primitive scattered facts you stated. That is all I was implying as many historians have about the first well documented advanced civilization.

 

We most definitely have evolved slowly during the ages but like I said, look back 150 years ago and how far we evolved from 10,000 years ago and than compare that to the last 100+ years. Not insinuating that all of our modern marvels are due to "aliens" but merely pointing out how quickly we advances in the last 1% of our known existence. Hard to solely point to the Industrial age and a reformed education.

Ummm some people could care less about politics. It wasnt meant to be a ignorant statement or question...

 

If you thought for a second that I might be one of "those people" then you really haven't been paying attention.

Hahaha. I am afraid not. See all of his opinion are based on facts that are supported with data and evidence logged by governments and military personnel. I know this because after coming across it, I asked a friend who works close to parliament in Ottawa and Paul supplied undeniable evidence.

 

What about Robert Dean? Former Commander Sargent Major of Norad. He had cosmic clearance, many steps higher than any president. He first speaks at the 6 minute mark, I read a lot of his interviews.

 

 

So...where is this undeniable evidence?

 

Undeniable evidence to me would be: A fcuking UFO landing on the White House lawn and giving a press conference. Or even space aliens just walking around. Or flying at a normal altitude so someone can film it without being blurry and unidentifiable. There are thousands of ways yet not a single fcuking one has happened.

If you thought for a second that I might be one of "those people" then you really haven't been paying attention.

 

I respect your opinion therefor I pay attention carefully... I was referring to this post of yours :

 

 

 

"Lets take this in another direction (because it segues into what I, and a lot of other folks who understand the US government believe).

 

Why? If aliens are visiting earth, why would the government hide that fact, but not prevent the discemination of the theory into the popular culture? And dont give me the. "To avoid a panic" bullshit.... I see zero indication, at this point, if Obama came out and said, "aliens have been visiting us, here is there spaceship , and meet ambasador squidhead...." That there would be any type of panic. Not to mention, the government fcuking loves it when the people is paniced. It gives them an excuse to do what they love most. Spend money on problems they cant fix.

 

If its, "but they would be pressured to protect the people and they cant so they dont admit it". Ok. Then why let the "theories" out there at all? You dont think the government could have shut up Art Bell thirty years ago? Or kept hollywood from popularizing sci-fi? The government has never done anything other than encourage these theories. To me that screams "then thats not what theyre hiding". If youre trying to keep a secret in plain sight nothing works better than to condition people to jump to a particular (incorrect) conclusion when they see an unfamiliar object in the sky.

 

I dont think a weather balloon crashed at Roswell. I dont think a space ship did either. I know a modern review of the contemporaneous reports on what crashed becomes a lot less spooky, as the materials reported are things we see all the time in our modern lives. And no. I dont think we stole Mylar or velcro from aliens."

 

 

I learned a lot about the government and its history of its leaders like I stated in my previous post and there has been many lies and things kept from the public. My broker and my attorney are well informed, experienced and wise and have opened my eyes a lot in regards to the government.

 

I asked do you know much about the CIA, FBI and NSA because there has been a lot of things done by these agencies that make them look very corrupt with probable cause of having their own agendas as they hold a lot of power and are able to easily abuse it...

 

For instance the NSA triangulating all of our smart phone positions every 15 minutes... CIA being called out many times for smuggling guns and drugs and even funding countries or freedom fighters.

 

I cannot tell you why they would hide or lie as I am definitely not trying to act like I know everything or even a lot on this subject, but I can state my opinion and experience of the fact that the government is anything but angelic and known for not always having the tax payers best interest on the top of their agenda.

 

So...where is this undeniable evidence?

 

Undeniable evidence to me would be: A fcuking UFO landing on the White House lawn and giving a press conference. Or even space aliens just walking around. Or flying at a normal altitude so someone can film it without being blurry and unidentifiable. There are thousands of ways yet not a single fcuking one has happened.

 

I am not a representative for the extra terrestrials so I can only speak from what god has blessed me with, which is common sense and logic. The primary reason why I am in my position at a young age with coming from being piss poor upon immigrating here. Being optimistic and opportunistic helps as well...

 

Did you watch the UFO's from the mainstream 12 min vid I posted? Received world wide media coverage? What about the most controversial one in years, the Jerusalem sighting seen by hundreds of people... Over the most treasured and oldest sights in the world with the highest no fly zone security.

 

America's military is years more advanced than any other country. What aircraft would you say can do this?

 

 

 

Also as I have mentioned that I have read up on this subject as it interests me and I don't come out of the dark dismissing a probable circumstance due to the fact that a UFO has never landed on the White House lawn...

 

All of the high ranking officials that chose to come out and speak of what they know/saw and face scrutiny all say that the aliens that we have been in contact with or are in contact with are advanced enough to know how our government and countries rule's work and abide by them.

 

Again this is someone who is giving an opinion based on hearing hundreds of other people's opinions and outlooks.

 

Not pointing fingers and saying ET is hiding in Area 51... Although many people believe Charles Hall, as do I since all his answers to the scrutiny he endured falls under common sense and logical answers that could be true.

 

 

WHAT.THE.fcuk.

I call for a ban of multiple members of this thread. Too many walls of text!!!

Given the massive size of the universe and the time it has existed, it is 100% certain that alien intelligence exists (or has existed) somewhere else in the universe.

It is 100% guaranteed they have never, and will never, find us on this planet.

 

Agree on some and disagree on some others. I think some have mentioned the following, but for example, I think this guy makes way too many assumptions:

 

1) He is assuming all of this about how impossible it all would be going by modern humans, with current human intelligence, with current human technology, with current human understanding of physics.

 

- What if our understanding of physics is wrong in certain ways?

 

- We don't know what dark matter is. We just mathematically know that it's there or else our theory of gravity is wrong.

 

- We have multiple theories for describing different aspects of the universe because not all the theories work as one unified theory.

 

So how can we be so certain that there is no fast-than-light travel? Maybe it could be done as mentioned by wormholes or whatnot. Technologically impossible? How do we know? Give another couple of hundred years of scientific and technological development and we might be able to develop technology that could do it.

 

2) What if you have an intelligence that is evolved to a higher level than current humans?

 

3) A mistake I think he makes in talking about how to search for life in the galaxy is that, you don't have to search all over. If you are looking for intelligent life, then you'll probably need to find an Earth-like planet. And Earth-like planets can only exist in a specific area of a galaxy like ours. Near the interior part of the galaxy, for example, the radiation is too great. So you search the areas where the radiation is tolerable. And then you look for stars and look at distances from the stars that would be appropriate for an Earth-like planet. Granted, this still would mean loads of numbers of possible stars, but I mean you don't just have to go everywhere

 

4) What makes him think that the alien life form couldn't perhaps send thousands of robots to do the exploring? They wouldn't necessarily need to send themselves.

 

5) No one can be 100% certain that intelligent life has existed. Intelligent life is one form of life and one that took a lot of time to develop. Lots of animals have intelligence, just at differing levels.

 

To find an intelligent life form capable of space travel would mean it would have to be a tool-making life form just like humans. And just because it is as intelligent as a human doesn't mean it would develop technology. Humans developed the scientific method that led to the industrial revolution a good deal because of Christianity and the peculiar way Christians viewed the cosmos and God. So the aliens would probably need something similar to develop formal science.

 

And it would have similarly likely had to develop the economics (because the laws of economics regarding supply and demand will remain the same regardless of how the life form is, even if they behave like ants), institutions, processes, etc...to develop sophisticated science and engineering and hence technology to then facilitate being able to travel through space.

 

I think there are intelligent life forms in the universe and perhaps our galaxy in the form of a animals with intelligence, like the equivalents of wolves, killer whales, etc...but for there to be civilizations would mean the equivalent of tool-making primates. They might be mammalian, reptilian, insect-like, or something altogether different, but they would have to have a humanoid form to be able to construct and use tools. They would also have to have a brain powerful enough for advanced thought.

Neil de Grasse Tyson made an incredibly stupid comment recently I thought. He said that he is afraid that aliens won't visit us because they might think we are not an intelligent life form if they see our television and movie and so forth broadcasts that have gone out into space.

 

Sooo.....the aliens will catch an episode of "The Simpsons" and figure, "Ehhh.....obviously a stupid life form, nothing to see here."

 

OH REALLY?

 

They wouldn't take into account that said life form has the ability to create such a thing and then to create the technology to BROADCAST it out into space? No curiosity generated there?

Romandad, I think you are wrong in your claim that the government could admit to having aliens and not freak anybody out. There are too many hardcore religious people in the country that would freak over that, and probably in the world. It would completely blow a hole through their belief system.

Also we cannot argue how interesting the Egyptians were who followed and how they were able to build the pyramids in the perfect architectural design with such heavy stones back in a time with no technology. The theory of the humongous stones being pushed on bamboo type branches and built from the ground up while building upwards and starting from the outside and working towards the inside have been proven wrong. There are no traces found of any sort of fire that would be needed to see in the dark for this build process. Many modern day architects swear that we would have an incredibly hard time even today to duplicate the pyramids with such precision and use of huge, heavy rocks.

 

While no one can be sure, considering that they had armies of slaves and around 30-40 years to build the pyramids, it probably was doable.

 

Not sure how politically informed or even interested you are in today's world but it would be very hard to deny that those politicians we put in place clearly work on their own agendas and a lot have ulterior motives. Those famous presidents would be Reagan, Clinton, the Bushes and so forth. It is clear what they have to gain by being in power with the companies they are/were involved in and the reasoning behind their actions while under control of the US.

 

Not sure how much you know about the CIA, FBI, NSA and so forth and how they really are rogue agencies out with their own agendas as well. Look what happened to Kennedy when he wanted to shut down the CIA...

 

You sure YOU haven't been abducted by aliens for a bit? Questioning whether Romandad keeps up-to-speed and is interested in political issues and current affairs is like questioning whether Michael Jordan was a decent basketball player :D :D

 

So with all that has happened and is going on in today's world by not just our present and previous leaders, but the Hussein's, Putin's, Castor's of the world, you cannot say that we are being lead by the most noble, trustworthy and deserving leaders who only have our best interest at heart.

 

I can think of many reasons why we would be lied to as we have been lied to for a very long time in regards to a lot more than just aliens.

 

You ask why the leaders would lie to us, I ask you why would they all of a sudden stop lying to us?

 

Doesn't it make you think how the hell we have come sooo far in regards to technology and other modern day advances in only the last 100+ years when we have been around for 6000-10,000+ years? When America dropped the Atomic bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, scientists say that even to this day the echo of such energy can be heard throughout the universe. This is an easily plausible explanation of why we have been seeing and documenting UFO sightings and even more crazier, how we have come so far since the 1940's as well in regards to modern day advances.

 

If you look into the Roswell crash, many former employees have said this was the first sighting of the circuit boards and other fascinating things.

 

Wheels's History of the How the Modern World Came to Be

 

How we came so far in the last 150+ years isn't hard IMO. The answer is capitalism, England and Christianity. England because England being an island began pioneering limited government, such as with the Magna Carta. Meanwhile at the same time, Christianity began pioneering science and various concepts of modern human rights. Over hundreds of years, England began limiting the power of the monarch more and more, as the individual power interests fought to limit the monarch's power so as to have influence themselves. Christians did a lot of investigating of science to understand how the cosmos and this world all created by God (in their view) worked. The Catholic Church also had an interest in figuring out certain aspects of astronomy for calculating certain dates. This all led to the development of the scientific method in the process. Meanwhile, developments in banking and finance also developed, primarily starting with the Medicis in Italy. Things like double-income accounting developed, and the joint stock company developed, at first as a way to finance overseas explorations in a more risk-averse manner.

 

As the English continued pioneering concepts of rights and limited government, they formed colonies overseas, in the New World. Eventually the colonies rebelled and America formed, which further developed what England had been developing government-wise, and created the precursor for the type of government most free countries have today (liberal democracy). Science was continuing its steady progress, along with commerce, finance, and banking, and rights. The steam engine was developed, first by James Watt, and the Industrial Revolution began, as people realized they could use steam-powered machinery to do things. Railroads were developed for transportation using steam power.

 

Industrialization led to further development of science and naturally curious scientists studied and learned about things such as electricity. Once enough understanding of electricity was developed, this further advanced industrialization. Steam-power was also of course advanced to ships which advanced trade and commerce more as well, and electricity furthered all of this too. Then the internal combustion engine was developed, and the first automobiles.

 

Then WWI happened, then a stock market boom in the 1920s with lots of new consumer goods developed. Then WW2 happened, and a crap ton of research and development was conducted, both on the part of the Nazis and the United States. The first computers were developed for military purposes, such as the ENIAC, and advances in aviation, materials science, chemicals, electronics, internal combustion engines, the atomic bomb (nuclear power) was developed, the Germans made advancements in rocket science and engineering, radar was developed, etc....after the war, the U.S. went and stole a bunch of patents and technologies from Germany and also took a lot of the scientists, to the major chagrin of Stalin.

 

Then started the Cold War. The Cold War defense budget continued the financing of research and development into science and technology. The transistor was developed, and then the Soviets put Sputnik into orbit, which panicked the U.S. government, so the space program was started. It was the defense budget and space program that were the major customers at first as the first transistors were expensive and regular civilian industry was still content to just use vacuum tubes, which were much cheaper. But transistors were much smaller and more energy-efficient, so the Space Program and military were very interested in them. Silicon Valley was born (there'd be no Silicon Valley or Intel as we know it if not for the defense budget and Space Program). Meanwhile business also was doing it's own corporate research as well.

 

Then the Space Race really went into high-gear with Kennedy's Moon challenge, and we got what constituted probably the greatest investment into research and development of science and technology in human history. Major advancements in electronics miniaturization, materials science, rocket science and engineering, chemistry, computer architecture, medical science, etc...all were made. The foundations of the Internet were formed. The fruits of all this R&D provided spin-off technologies that the civilian world adopted and developed into whole-new industries.

 

With the development of the computer, things really went into overdrive research and development-wise and productivity-wise. Satellites launched into space with the rocket technology revolutionized weather forecasting and understanding of the Earth's atmosphere, weather, and climate, and also advanced geology for searching for oil as well. They also advanced communications.

 

And hence basically building on this up to where we are now. For thousands of years, humans did not have the unique circumstances of England, Christianity, and modern capitalism's development, and thus although humans had plenty of intellectual talent, the resources, processes, institutions, etc...to facilitate the development of modern societies simply did not exist. It is sad, but yes war was one of the primary catalysts for technological development.

 

Basically if Hitler hadn't been an asshole, there'd probably be no LamboPower today.

Romandad, I think you are wrong in your claim that the government could admit to having aliens and not freak anybody out. There are too many hardcore religious people in the country that would freak over that, and probably in the world. It would completely blow a hole through their belief system.

 

 

I hear that said all the time.... And I know a lot of these so called religious people... Not a one of whom has their religious views undermined by the possibility of extraterrestrial life. It's a canard. One has absolutely nothing to do with the other.

 

I hear that said all the time.... And I know a lot of these so called religious people... Not a one of whom has their religious views undermined by the possibility of extraterrestrial life. It's a canard. One has absolutely nothing to do with the other.

 

I think it depends on the religious person. If extraterrestrial life exists, it undermines the concept of God creating humans via Adam and Eve and Eve eating the apple and thus Jesus having to die on the cross to save us and all of that. If the aliens are capable of interstellar travel, then they are smarter and superior to us humans. I suppose one could say that God created the aliens, but IMO the aliens would really mess with the narrative.