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Luxeous

Is the Model X a perfect daily driver?

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"Stories" like this is what ruins the facts. Cold weather is a lot better for batteries than hot weather. You lose a small insignificant amount of energy in cold weather (1-2%), but the batteries lasts a lot longer.

 

I have zero personal experience with EV's beyond having driven a couple of Model S's that belonged to friends, but this is wildly inconsistent with everything I have ever read in the automotive press. To use just one example, the latest Car & Driver states in responding to a subscriber letter that their real world testing of EV's has shown a range difference between cold and warm weather of "greater than 25%." Now maybe there is a distinction between range and "energy" here (although not one that could account for that much difference), but I think what owners care about is range. If an EV's range is 250 miles in warm weather but only 185-190 in cold weather that is a big deal IMO. Also, my friends with the model S's like them, but they will gladly admit that there is a significant difference in range in cold v. warm weather, and that their real world range (not driving aggressively but not driving like a granny either) is a good 10-15% below Tesla's "rated" range, even in warm weather when brand new.

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Tesla will be a wholly owned subsidiary in a few years. Cash burn, production and quality problems, and many more direct competitors. Model 3 margins are razor thin even when they are loaded. Europeans and GM don't need another luxury brand. Ford is getting out of cars. My money is on the Chinese once the stock implodes. The valuation is unsustainable. Aramco IPO is going nowhere for now so I doubt the Saudi's are coming to the rescue.

 

Musk owes a shit pile of money backed by his TSLA stock and at some point GS will start a fire sale. He would be smart to sell well before then, but i'm not sure anyone is eager to buy without a steep discount.

 

I sure wouldn't want to be on the longterm end of stock or car ownership.

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Yes, I'm on my second Model S :) The main reason I think I'll end up with the Audi instead of a Model 3 or S is that Tesla's service capacity here is already maxed out. If I book service now I will probably get it January... A lot of people have their cars at Tesla for months waiting to be fixed. Luckily I have never had any major issues the five years and over 150,000 km driven, but if something should happen I'm afraid to think about the waiting time. And this is with only Model S and X in the market, when Model 3 is released I wouldn't be surprised if you have to wait 6 to 10 months for a service appointment.

 

The Porsche I'm getting either way!

 

 

Don't count on Audi service either. They're awful too.

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Don't count on Audi service either. They're awful too.

 

It’s your local dealer IMO, for the last 7 years I’ve had at least one Audi car in the family and the service and customer service has been perfect. Loan cars, free pick up of our cars and deliveries, etc. I guess like anything, unfortunately, it comes down to your relationship.

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Hire a god damn warehouse which can house 300 people, place your shitbox in the middle and take the cover off of it so everyone can see it, put some finger food around a bit of music and some water and let people enjoy it like that, have those morons ever seen a car release??

 

That is usually called as unveiling at car dealership or showroom. :lol2:

They really are new at the game lol :D

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I have zero personal experience with EV's beyond having driven a couple of Model S's that belonged to friends, but this is wildly inconsistent with everything I have ever read in the automotive press. To use just one example, the latest Car & Driver states in responding to a subscriber letter that their real world testing of EV's has shown a range difference between cold and warm weather of "greater than 25%." Now maybe there is a distinction between range and "energy" here (although not one that could account for that much difference), but I think what owners care about is range. If an EV's range is 250 miles in warm weather but only 185-190 in cold weather that is a big deal IMO. Also, my friends with the model S's like them, but they will gladly admit that there is a significant difference in range in cold v. warm weather, and that their real world range (not driving aggressively but not driving like a granny either) is a good 10-15% below Tesla's "rated" range, even in warm weather when brand new.

 

Few friends have hybrid BMW's and at winter they have been extremely useless. Very sluggish to even move when it is -10 °c or below.

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I have zero personal experience with EV's beyond having driven a couple of Model S's that belonged to friends, but this is wildly inconsistent with everything I have ever read in the automotive press. To use just one example, the latest Car & Driver states in responding to a subscriber letter that their real world testing of EV's has shown a range difference between cold and warm weather of "greater than 25%." Now maybe there is a distinction between range and "energy" here (although not one that could account for that much difference), but I think what owners care about is range. If an EV's range is 250 miles in warm weather but only 185-190 in cold weather that is a big deal IMO. Also, my friends with the model S's like them, but they will gladly admit that there is a significant difference in range in cold v. warm weather, and that their real world range (not driving aggressively but not driving like a granny either) is a good 10-15% below Tesla's "rated" range, even in warm weather when brand new.

Cake was commenting battery life, probably indicating the battery degrades faster? Range is a completely different thing, and is obviously shorter in cold climates.

The available energy goes down a little, on my car it's around 395 km in the summer and 385 in the winter at 90% charge. Basically nothing.

 

The energy consumption goes up a lot, 10-15% shorter range is about right. On a car with a range like the Tesla this isn't a big deal imo. On a car with a smaller battery you can lose up to 40-50% however because they use about the same amount of energy for heat etc, and this is a huge part of their energy available.

 

But in the long run cold weather has a positive effect on battery lifespan.

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Don't count on Audi service either. They're awful too.

I think Audi around here is good, Porsche too.

And they're both about 5 minutes away from me, Tesla is an hour away.

 

The guys working at Tesla around here do a decent job, but they are severely stifled by the organization. Common parts like door handles takes 3-4 months to get, they are overloaded with a huge backlog due to capacity issues, and in all this a lot of customers are receiving little to no feedback on their issue.

 

I always get a loaner when needed, and they fix critical issues on drop ins though. Still I've heard of people driving 4-5 hours to a service appointment only to get there and hear they don't actually have time to even start working on the car.

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Cake was commenting battery life, probably indicating the battery degrades faster? Range is a completely different thing, and is obviously shorter in cold climates.

The available energy goes down a little, on my car it's around 395 km in the summer and 385 in the winter at 90% charge. Basically nothing.

 

The energy consumption goes up a lot, 10-15% shorter range is about right. On a car with a range like the Tesla this isn't a big deal imo. On a car with a smaller battery you can lose up to 40-50% however because they use about the same amount of energy for heat etc, and this is a huge part of their energy available.

 

But in the long run cold weather has a positive effect on battery lifespan.

 

Why do they rate the "available energy" as a certain amount of kilometers if the energy consumption increases and thus decreases the range? Or did you mean kilowatt-hours instead of km...?

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Why do they rate the "available energy" as a certain amount of kilometers if the energy consumption increases and thus decreases the range? Or did you mean kilowatt-hours instead of km...?

Tesla uses a static value to convert kw/h to range so it's a direct indicator of how much energy is available. It's actually a lot more convenient than cars that constantly change the estimated range based on the current consumption. You can see estimated range based on the last 10/25/50 km in the Tesla as well, but this is not the range indicated in the dashboard.

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