Anybody get screwed by Madoff?

off topic but my professor's son was the one that teepee Madoff's son in Palm Beach. While only in high school, he lost his trust fund to him. Professor is a well known eminent domain attorney.

off topic but my professor's son was the one that teepee Madoff's son in Palm Beach.

 

What?

 

off topic but my professor's son was the one that teepee Madoff's son in Palm Beach. While only in high school, he lost his trust fund to him. Professor is a well known eminent domain attorney.

 

Wat? Is your professor an American Indian? After building Madoff Jr's teepee did they smoke-um the piece pipe and get some info out of him?

Madoff's accountant charged with fraud. Got to hand it to Madoff here, he found someone to rubber stamp his cooked books on the cheap! Only cost him around 150k a year "certify" the largest fraud in history. I feel sorry for the accountant(who also lost family money to the scheme), I doubt he thought he would facing this >>>

 

Friehling faces up to 105 years in prison if he is convicted. He is charged with securities fraud, aiding and abetting investment adviser fraud and four counts of filing false audit reports with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission

 

"Unfortunately there is no way to actually have a policy on money that you have invested in the markets. It has been explored in the past and would never work. The possbility of loss to an insurer is too high to actuarily calculate into a 'maturity to expectancy' scale for insurer profitability... Policy lapse rate would be too low and especially with this Madoff shit, no one would be willing to underwrite an investment fund... "

 

Not true, SEC has insured the brokerage accounts for $500k, thats been posted in the news, albeit small print...so those that have at least 500k did not lose everything as the news spins....the others caught up on other ponzi schemes not involving SEC insurance are not so fortunate, and expect to see more of Bernie's compadres indicted!

"Unfortunately there is no way to actually have a policy on money that you have invested in the markets. It has been explored in the past and would never work. The possbility of loss to an insurer is too high to actuarily calculate into a 'maturity to expectancy' scale for insurer profitability... Policy lapse rate would be too low and especially with this Madoff shit, no one would be willing to underwrite an investment fund... "

 

Not true, SEC has insured the brokerage accounts for $500k, thats been posted in the news, albeit small print...so those that have at least 500k did not lose everything as the news spins....the others caught up on other ponzi schemes not involving SEC insurance are not so fortunate, and expect to see more of Bernie's compadres indicted!

He was asking about actual institutionalized, everyday, security investment insurance that any AIG, Farmers, Allsate, Loyds or whatever insurance company would have. NOT government infused emergency coverage spurned by the largest fraud in history...

Let me be more clear. Direct from the The Securities Investor Protection Corporation (SIPC), website

I dont know where you got the " infused emergency coverage " from, its been in place for years.

 

"What SIPC Covers... What it Does Not

The cash and securities – such as stocks and bonds – held by a customer at a financially troubled brokerage firm are protected by SIPC.

 

Among the investments that are ineligible for SIPC protection are commodity futures contracts and currency, as well as investment contracts (such as limited partnerships) and fixed annuity contracts that are not registered with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission under the Securities Act of 1933.

 

It is important to recognize that SIPC does not work the same way as the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation in terms of blanket protection of losses"

 

"only" $700k? I guess I was under the impression Madoff only dealt with the upper end of the spectrum, well into the 7 figure range for the portfolios he would oversee.

 

He probably had his money with a fund of funds that had money with Madoff.

150 Years.....Wonder if he'll make it.....

 

Have fun in jail asshole.

From what I understand, Madoff never invested a dime of the ponzi money he scammed from his clients. So if he didn't lose any of it thru bad investments, where did the estimated 13 to 20 billion go?

There is no way he spent it all on his personal lifestyle.

 

Soooo.....I wonder where he stashed the loot and how long it takes before Ruthie and other family members/accomplices start tapping into it.

 

Bernie got the sentence he deserved, but the case is far from closed.

From what I understand, Madoff never invested a dime of the ponzi money he scammed from his clients. So if he didn't lose any of it thru bad investments, where did the estimated 13 to 20 billion go?

There is no way he spent it all on his personal lifestyle.

 

Soooo.....I wonder where he stashed the loot and how long it takes before Ruthie and other family members start tapping into it.

 

Bernie got the sentence he deserved, but the case is far from closed.

 

 

That sum is just too large for even banks to just sit on, even for Swiss banks.

150 Years.....Wonder if he'll make it.....

 

Have fun in jail asshole.

 

 

I hope his asshole has alot of fun in jail being pummeled over and over again.

That sum is just too large for even banks to just sit on, even for Swiss banks.

 

He was working with a bunch of sketchy feeder hedge funds, whose managers, over the years, pocketed billions in fees based on fictitious profits so some of those fees may be recoverable.

 

Also, he had a legitimate company, plus many, many contacts on the Street.

 

I doubt he was operating alone, so some of the money, perhaps billions may be hidden somewhere.

It broke my heart to hear the interview of a 90 year old man today who had lost his fortune to madoff. The guy said he lost his fortune the first time during the great depression only to have built it back up and lose it with madoff. The guy is currently working in a supermarket at $10/hour, his response when the reporter asked him how he was going to manage while working at the supermarket? "this is only temporary, I'm going to save up a little money and start my own business again. I'll be back on top before you know it!"

 

DAMN!

OOOOO, he shouldn't have put all of his money into Madoff's fund! Well he might make it, if he is one of those who can get to 100 years-old while still being mobile, he could start a business and build up some $$$.

It broke my heart to hear the interview of a 90 year old man today who had lost his fortune to madoff. The guy said he lost his fortune the first time during the great depression only to have built it back up and lose it with madoff. The guy is currently working in a supermarket at $10/hour, his response when the reporter asked him how he was going to manage while working at the supermarket? "this is only temporary, I'm going to save up a little money and start my own business again. I'll be back on top before you know it!"

 

DAMN!

How did he loose his fortune during the Great Depression if he was only around 11 years old when the Great Depression started? I dont know any 11 year old that is concerned with making money at that age.

It broke my heart to hear the interview of a 90 year old man today who had lost his fortune to madoff. The guy said he lost his fortune the first time during the great depression only to have built it back up and lose it with madoff. The guy is currently working in a supermarket at $10/hour, his response when the reporter asked him how he was going to manage while working at the supermarket? "this is only temporary, I'm going to save up a little money and start my own business again. I'll be back on top before you know it!"

 

DAMN!

 

Sounds quite intriguing! You have any more info on this story?

From what I understand, Madoff never invested a dime of the ponzi money he scammed from his clients. So if he didn't lose any of it thru bad investments, where did the estimated 13 to 20 billion go?

There is no way he spent it all on his personal lifestyle.

 

Soooo.....I wonder where he stashed the loot and how long it takes before Ruthie and other family members/accomplices start tapping into it.

 

Bernie got the sentence he deserved, but the case is far from closed.

 

150 years in jail for a 70 year old piece of shit is a joke . I love the way Bernie is taking the fall for all the other scumbags that were his accomplices . One has to be stupid to believe that he acted on his own.

It is a shame that the death sentence cannot be applied for white collar crime. If anything, Bernie should be executed and that would be the best way to send out a message to all the future crooks and con artists

How did he loose his fortune during the Great Depression if he was only around 11 years old when the Great Depression started? I dont know any 11 year old that is concerned with making money at that age.

 

I'm guessing he didn't literally mean "his" fortune... but that his parents lost everything and in turn he was left without much to eat even. When my grandparents (similar age) speak of it they say "we" because they went through it as well. Beyond that, in that era kids were put to work when they had to. Growing up on farms etc, during the depression wasn't a free ride by any stretch.

From what I understand, Madoff never invested a dime of the ponzi money he scammed from his clients. So if he didn't lose any of it thru bad investments, where did the estimated 13 to 20 billion go?

There is no way he spent it all on his personal lifestyle.

 

Soooo.....I wonder where he stashed the loot and how long it takes before Ruthie and other family members/accomplices start tapping into it.

 

Bernie got the sentence he deserved, but the case is far from closed.

 

 

I don't doubt that there is cash hidden, but I would be surprised if its a lot (relatively speaking). From what I've heard, people are claiming that there was just north of $10B "invested". Let's for a minute assume that that's true. That would put his balance sheet at the $30-60B under management that people are claiming to be the paper losses in this case. If you are paying dividends on even $30B at, say, 8% (his low-side returns), you are paying out approx $2.4B/year. It doesn't take much of a swing in the market to put you under and expose the whole thing. This whole thing was "financed" by new investors and a little investing here and there. Once you lose the actual investment income and experience a slow-down on new investor recruting, the shelf life shrinks fast.

 

I don't see the feds finding billions in hidden money in this case. The money was either spent, lost in the marketplace, or used to pay dividends and/or as principal repayment. I could see a lot of people getting hit with claw-back suits though.

 

Thoughts?

150 years in jail for a 70 year old piece of shit is a joke . I love the way Bernie is taking the fall for all the other scumbags that were his accomplices . One has to be stupid to believe that he acted on his own.

It is a shame that the death sentence cannot be applied for white collar crime. If anything, Bernie should be executed and that would be the best way to send out a message to all the future crooks and con artists

 

I'm pretty sure he would rather have the death sentence then the jail sentence. I know I would. Why would I want to spend the final days of my life in jail after being a billionaire?

I don't see the feds finding billions in hidden money in this case. The money was either spent, lost in the marketplace, or used to pay dividends and/or as principal repayment. I could see a lot of people getting hit with claw-back suits though.

 

Thoughts?

 

From the Bottom Shekel:

 

Most of the money, it turns out, was funneled to Madoff's network of distributors and marketers, and since this fraud scheme went on for 20 years, the money effectively evaporated.

 

Each of those funds charged its clients a 1% annual commission, a 20% success commission and, unbelievably, a 5% joining fee.

 

When all these fees are calculated over a 20-year period, assuming that Madoff did not invest the money at all, or invested and lost it - a possibility being explored by investigators - any remaining mystery is unraveled. The clients' money gradually but continuously trickled into the pockets of the distributors, the "managers" of the hedge funds that recruited clients for Madoff.

 

The following is a sample calculation: A. invests $1 million in a Madoff feeder fund and leaves it there for 20 years. At the outset, A. forfeits $50,000 as a joining fee. Each year a management fee of 1% is deducted from his accumulated balance - the principal plus the fictitious profits. With annual returns of 10%, the principal doubles every 7 years, and 20% of the (fictitious) profits are deducted each year in success commissions. Over a 20-year period, those commissions add up to about $600,000, and this sum, combined with the management fees, amounts to about $1.1 million, or slightly more than the original investment. In this way, Madoff and his distributors milked their clients dry.

 

What a fcuking mess, I agree, clawbacks will be keeping the lawyers busy for years, maybe even a decade!

 

Its interesting to note that this is the way all managed money funds work, even your 401k.....your nut constantly gets clipped by fees, some hidden, some in plain sight and win or lose, the fund managers will always take their cut first!

Bernard Madoff son 'found hanged in New York'

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-11976801

 

RIP.

There is an article about Madoff on the Cover of today's WSJ. I have not had a chance to read all of it yet though.

Bernard Madoff son 'found hanged in New York'

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-11976801

 

RIP.

 

 

Hmmm pops took the fall and got locked up, and he's scott free(for all we know), wonder what the hang up was?