So I know we're not supposed to talk politics - Presidential Election - Poll

I think you bring up a really good point. I think part of this has to do with the overall health of Americans from a couple of perspectives 1) diet and physical activity and 2) environmental factors.

 

 

The same goes for lifestyles and diets. This isn't something the government can do much about asides from requiring adequate safety and sanitary conditions as well and maybe calorie counts on foods, but peoples lifestyle choices will cost both them and the economy in the long run. Being overweight, sedentary, and having a bad diet affects basically every organ and joint, and for the US to be paying so much for healthcare while having such a significant portion of overweight, sedentary individuals almost makes sense actually. Healthcare issues, especially ones which are lifestyle induced, will be chronic and the costs to address them will be paid over and over and over. The treatment isn't a one time deal.

 

Yeah but last I remember healthcare costs in the US were DOUBLE the average of the EU. Surely, the higher proportion of obese people, can't really make up for all of that, considering the inherent inefficiencies of a state run program, and also the US's younger (and in theory less prone to getting sick) population. Costs might be even higher than that if we were in the exact same circumstances. I find this situation quite hard to grasp.

Yeah but last I remember healthcare costs in the US were DOUBLE the average of the EU. Surely, the higher proportion of obese people, can't really make up for all of that, considering the inherent inefficiencies of a state run program, and also the US's younger (and in theory less prone to getting sick) population. Costs might be even higher than that if we were in the exact same circumstances. I find this situation quite hard to grasp.

Well my theory will potentially account for some portion of the difference not necessarily all of it. It would make sense that an unhealthier population has higher healthcare costs.

This would be a long and complex discussion and completely off topic. Very easy to educate yourself these days.

 

Could be a discussion for Wheels World Any decent books you could point to?

 

The reason Eu countries spend on healthcare is not because they don't spend on military it's because they tax their citizens more. Military spending could easily be made up but they never saw a need since the US traded military protection for influence during the post ww2 era. ANd that has been far more to the US's advantage than you care to admit.

 

I fully understand that the U.S. being the main protector has had great benefits to the U.S. in terms of both influence and the U.S.'s own security. I also think that having a central protector with allies backing it up is the best way to have things, because if everybody tries to be equal in power where no one has enough power to really do anything on their own and thus any major action requires everyone coming together, then if a crises happens, chances are nothing will get done until it is too late because no one will know who should do what.

 

I do not know if there would be enough tax revenue to really increase defense spending to the amount needed. They would probably need to raise taxes even further. For example, the British NHS has had budget issues as of late, but so has their military. Their governments have consistently reduced military spending as a percentage of GDP from around 4% to two-something percent.

 

US GDP/tax ratio is somewhere around 25% fed+states, average EU is 40% of gdp collected as taxes. Average healthcare spending in EU is around 9% of GDP. Do the math, in order for the US to have healthcare that would mean a 33% increase in tax collection to maintain current spending on other stuff. It would be quite a shock for everyone if that happened. If Americans also want free university education add another 3-4% percentage points of gdp, and you'd all end up with a 50% increase in all taxes you pay. You'll be starting a new revolution if it ever gets to that.

 

Hilarious how so many want free college, free healthcare, etc...but nobody wants to pay any taxes.

 

What I don't get is that healthcare costs in the US despite not having socialized healthcare are twice as high as in other developed countries. You'd say they'd be lower, it's quite counter intuitive, which is why I don't understand this phenomenon.

 

Reasons I have read on this issue are the U.S. has a lot more of the expensive machines needed such as MRIs, CT scanners, PT scanners, etc...and uses them more. There is more defensive medicine as doctors are afraid they'll get sued. Drug prices are a lot higher. Some say this is because the U.S. does the majority of drug research, so it pays the brunt of the cost. European systems can negotiate prices with drug companies; I don't know if that would be possible in the U.S. The U.S. does do a huge amount of drug development, so I don't know if one really could negotiate down the prices with the drug companies without creating waiting times in place. Some also cite administration costs that aren't present with single-payer systems, but that doesn't explain how the multipayer systems avoid the issue.

 

lambornima's point about America having so many fat-asses is good too; would be interesting to read some studies on just how much the obesity issue here drives healthcare costs.

My first question would be, why do we need to spend so much on the military? We spend about 10 times more than Russia does.

 

Yeah, but Russia doesn't underwrite global trade and security and protect so many countries everywhere and the existing military it does have is not known for being very professional. The U.S. has the job of keeping the sea lanes open, protecting South Korea from North Korea, protecting Japan and Taiwan from China, protecting Europe from Russia, preventing Iran from closing the Strait of Hormuz, etc...and unfortunately, good militaries are very expensive. You need top equipment and then a budget to train your personnel, and then maintenance is a big issue, and then you have to take into account that say around a third of your equipment and vehicles are out of commission at any one time due to undergoing maintenance and repairs, so you have to have enough available to field taking that into account, and so forth.

 

What's ironic is that as it is, the U.S. probably really doesn't spend enough on defense for its global duties, but the money just isn't there right now. It is supposed to be able to fight a two-front war. As it is, it could probably barely manage a one-front war most likely at the moment.

I'm not saying that we shouldn't spend on the military. I'm just saying that we would probably be fine spending 9.5 times the amount of Russia and then have money to take care of the elderly and our vets instead of protecting some shit head country that wants us dead anyway.

Spicey out

One thing is certain. A hospital is a business. They dont charge a lot just because they can. They have to make sure those who pay are covering the costs for those who dont. We all know a HUGE portion is those who use the hospital emergency room as a free clinic.

 

I would bet a large percentage of these are illegals. I think controlling the border will help more way than one.

I'm not saying that we shouldn't spend on the military. I'm just saying that we would probably be fine spending 9.5 times the amount of Russia and then have money to take care of the elderly and our vets instead of protecting some shit head country that wants us dead anyway.

 

The problem with the VA system is that it is a single-payer system that is a totally socialist government bureaucracy and a very entrenched one at that, with a lot of corruption, and thus very difficult to make changes to. If it served the whole public, there might be more pressure for Congress to force changes, but since it just serves vets, the public pressure isn't there.

So one of Paki's friends shot Scalise....

A militant liberal, who knew

Also, FBI probe widening. Surprised Fox was one of the first to carry the story.

Also, FBI probe widening. Surprised Fox was one of the first to carry the story.

 

 

Stfu! Trump now under investigation by Mueller and Mike Rogers is a lying sack of shit.

 

Also sessions reasoning behind his recusal actually creates a bigger problem for himself.

Angela Merkel's Anti-Trump Alliance Crumbling Ahead of G-20

 

It is a defeat for Merkel, and not just when it comes to climate policy. It is also a setback for her claim to leadership on the global stage. Germany's geopolitical influence, the incident shows, remains limited. When it comes to power, security and interests, Germany is a not a global player, but a mid-sized power that isn't even able to keep Europe together.

 

The German chancellor may have become the hero of liberals and democrats around the globe, but she is unable to fulfill the expectations placed on her as the putative "leader of the free world," at least not when it comes to power politics. Even Merkel's psychological deftness in dealing with the posturing potentates of the world isn't enough to make up for the fact that Germany is not a global power when it comes to foreign and security policy.

 

This is exactly what I was saying about some pages ago when Trump did the pullout, about how power in the international realm is defined by who is the strongest militarily and economically, that the idea that pulling out would mean Trump (and hence the U.S.) would be dealing from a position of weakness just doesn't hold up. Now we see that when push comes to shove, this is indeed the case.

Holy shit I never thought I'd see the day with a vice article with this headline

https://news.vice.com/story/extremism-exper...-about-the-left

Holy shit I never thought I'd see the day with a vice article with this headline

https://news.vice.com/story/extremism-exper...-about-the-left

 

But those later organizations mostly targeted institutions; in the modern era, politically motivated violence perpetrated by angry lone-wolf attackers bearing automatic rifles, of the sort carried out in Wednesday’s attack, has until now largely been a modus operandi of the far right.

 

I don't remember any of the mass shooters in recent times being crazy right-wingers.

Love trumps hate! When they go low we go high or some bullshit like that

http://fox59.com/2017/06/15/several-shots-...-flag-on-i-465/

Mueller is these asshats worst nightmare. Firing Comey only accelerated this administrations demise.

Mueller is these asshats worst nightmare. Firing Comey only accelerated this administrations demise.

 

 

Trump impeached in 4...3....2.....

Trump impeached in 4...3....2.....

 

2.5.....2.25.....going to be the longest countdown ever.

Mueller is these asshats worst nightmare. Firing Comey only accelerated this administrations demise.

 

This is true, but to be fair that guy (with unlimited funds and now 13 other attorneys on his team) could find something on literally anyone. Will be interesting to see what path they take to dig through every thought Trump had over the past 5 months.

 

Trump impeached in 4...3....2.....

 

I think it is highly unlikely while Republicans control the House and Senate. That said we'll soon see how Trump's behauvior will effect the 2018 midterms.

Trump impeached in 4...3....2.....

 

I think it is highly unlikely while Republicans control the House and Senate. That said we'll soon see how Trump's behauvior will effect the 2018 midterms.

This is true, but to be fair that guy (with unlimited funds and now 13 other attorneys on his team) could find something on literally anyone. Will be interesting to see what path they take to dig through every thought Trump had over the past 5 months.

 

 

Therein lies the rub. Politics aside, no one can withstand that level of scrutiny let alone the Ass clowns that surround trump. People will get indicted, dont know who, but heads will roll.

I think off topic issues on a car forum are not for me. None of this is very fruitful in the long run. No minds will change, aggression forms, Lol I will just stick with the Lamborghini machine.

I think off topic issues on a car forum are not for me. None of this is very fruitful in the long run. No minds will change, aggression forms, Lol I will just stick with the Lamborghini machine.

 

 

Aggression? Lol.

 

This just in, Trump's lawyer hires his own lawyer...

 

https://www.google.com/amp/www.cnbc.com/amp...own-lawyer.html