7.2 quake rocks japan

uh oh.... Preasure drop after third explosion...Radiation levels increase

 

 

Chernobyl.

 

The U.S. official said water being pumped in is disappearing faster than it would if it only were caused by evaporation, which suggests there may be a leak in the reactor's containment vessel. But, the official said, it also could be that there is so much pressure inside the reactor that it is hard to pump in water.

 

A government official said that though the level of radiation rose around the reactor, there was no danger.

 

"The radioactive level near unit 2 has gone up, but at this juncture, the level is not judged to be immediately harmful to human bodies," said Noriyuki Shikata, a spokesman in the prime minister's office.

Gilbert Godfried fired as the voice of the AFLAC duck for insensitive tsunami jokes on twitter.

Countdown until pat robertson says something stupid-

 

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just glad they had enough time to have evacuated the surrounding population. Even if it does end up melting down, the fact it has held this long, more then enough time for people to be moved to safety is great

Just got off of the phone with my pops. Hope this helps...feel free to keep questions coming.

 

^ I forget exactly what my friend mentioned, but as I recall the time to cool a reactor to "servicing" levels was in the area of 30 days.

 

I can only assume that was with the cooling system still pumping. Those things are thousands of tons of high grade alloys and that shit just stays hot for a while.

 

To cool a reactor to servicing levels takes anywhere from 3-8 days depending on the plant, the management at that plant, and the project manager. To cool a reactor to the same levels take milliseconds in the event of an emergency (assuming everything works right). The plant operator SCRAMS the reactor which involves inserting the control rods fully into the reactor while flooding the reactor with boric acid usually in the form of borated water.

 

It wasnt the rods....

 

 

Regardless of what position the rods are in, the HEAT doesn't just STOP....

 

Think of a car engine. You turn off the car but a few hours later, the engine block is still hot to the touch right?

 

Well, in a Nuclear Reactor its pretty much the same.... The Fuel is still HOT... REALLY HOT.... for a LONG TIME after the reaction is shut down.

 

Which is why they COOL the entire system using pumped water (just like your cars radiator). It gets pumped in cold, takes the heat of the reactor, turns to steam, the hot steam leaves the reactor, it heats up a boiler, that spins an electrical generator and cools the steam back to water where its ready for the trip again.... If you dont keep that water/steam system pumping, even AFTER the reaction has technically stopped, THINGS MELT. Worse... If the water in the reactor drops, the fuel gets exposed to air.... When Uranium is exposed to Oxygen, it burns. When the tubes that the Uranium is cased in is exposed to oxygen, it produces Hydrogen. Hydrogen gets exposed to heat (which is a pretty common element in a nuclear reactor) and HYDROGEN EXPLODES.

 

 

The back up diesel generators that power the cooling pumps got broken by the Tsunami. They may have just flooded... Some are saying the Fuel tanks were just swept away by the water.... Either way.... They stopped pumping water into the reactor... The Water level dropped, and bad things started happening.

 

90% correct.

 

Regardless of whether we have SCRAM'd the reactor or cooled it down to serviceable levels the reactor core is still extremely hot. The core needs to be cooled constantly to avoid a partial or complete meltdown. On a normal outage they continue to circulate coolant in the reactor via a hot mid-loop which basically bypasses the steam generator and that is it.

 

In the case of our SCRAM'd reactor you have the additional variable of the borated water. If you can't continue to circulate coolant the heat continues to transfer from the core to the surrounding water but that water isn't moving through the cooling system. The water then turns to steam which A. increases pressure in the reactor and B. drops the water level down exposing the fuel assembly to air. This is bad for 2 reasons which were touched on above.

 

When the fuel assembly is exposed to air it no longer has a friendly heat transfer structure in place as water > air at removing heat. This allows the assembly to increase in temperature and melt the fuel pelt casings which are made out of a zinc alloy. When the zinc alloy starts to melt combined with the borated water it gives off Hydrogen Gas. You now have steam and hydrogen gas building up pressure in the reactor with no where to go.

 

Additionally you risk the fuel assembly that is exposed to air catching on fire. If it catches on fire and then ignites the hydrogen in the reactor it explodes...a la Chernobyl (dammit I said Chernobyl). However it explodes inside the containment vessel which is designed to keep all of that inside of it.

 

In order to keep the risk of explosion to a minimum and the reactor core intact the plant (like Japan has done) decides to vent the steam and the hydrogen risking a relatively small radiation leak and possible explosion OUTSIDE of the reactor and the containment vessel rather than inside the reactor or containment vessel which would be far worse.

 

Make sense?

Countdown until pat robertson says something stupid-

 

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WNBA player Cappie Pondexter had to get in on it too:

 

http://deadspin.com/#!5781753/look-wnb...s-male-athletes

So I wonder what the economic ramifications are going to be because of this. Japan is the second-largest foreign holder of America's debt. If they are really hurt economically from this, will they be able to continue buying our debt?

The waves hitting santa cruz. Starts at 0:50. Look at the moron at 2:44

Just got off of the phone with my pops. Hope this helps...feel free to keep questions coming.

 

 

 

To cool a reactor to servicing levels takes anywhere from 3-8 days depending on the plant, the management at that plant, and the project manager. To cool a reactor to the same levels take milliseconds in the event of an emergency (assuming everything works right). The plant operator SCRAMS the reactor which involves inserting the control rods fully into the reactor while flooding the reactor with boric acid usually in the form of borated water.

 

 

 

90% correct.

 

Regardless of whether we have SCRAM'd the reactor or cooled it down to serviceable levels the reactor core is still extremely hot. The core needs to be cooled constantly to avoid a partial or complete meltdown. On a normal outage they continue to circulate coolant in the reactor via a hot mid-loop which basically bypasses the steam generator and that is it.

 

In the case of our SCRAM'd reactor you have the additional variable of the borated water. If you can't continue to circulate coolant the heat continues to transfer from the core to the surrounding water but that water isn't moving through the cooling system. The water then turns to steam which A. increases pressure in the reactor and B. drops the water level down exposing the fuel assembly to air. This is bad for 2 reasons which were touched on above.

 

When the fuel assembly is exposed to air it no longer has a friendly heat transfer structure in place as water > air at removing heat. This allows the assembly to increase in temperature and melt the fuel pelt casings which are made out of a zinc alloy. When the zinc alloy starts to melt combined with the borated water it gives off Hydrogen Gas. You now have steam and hydrogen gas building up pressure in the reactor with no where to go.

 

Additionally you risk the fuel assembly that is exposed to air catching on fire. If it catches on fire and then ignites the hydrogen in the reactor it explodes...a la Chernobyl (dammit I said Chernobyl). However it explodes inside the containment vessel which is designed to keep all of that inside of it.

 

In order to keep the risk of explosion to a minimum and the reactor core intact the plant (like Japan has done) decides to vent the steam and the hydrogen risking a relatively small radiation leak and possible explosion OUTSIDE of the reactor and the containment vessel rather than inside the reactor or containment vessel which would be far worse.

 

Make sense?

 

So a scram'd reactor still outputs plenty of heat energy right?

The waves hitting santa cruz. Starts at 0:50. Look at the moron at 2:44

 

poor Santa Cruz, that little Cali coastal town is JINXED! Every natural disaster seems to find it's way to Santa Cruz. Close to epicenter in the Loma Prieta earthquake which I experienced in the bay area, torrential rains in the winter are a regular event leading to mudslides. Wildfires are always a threat, and somehow the Japanese earthquake/tsunami wave found its way right into Santa Cruz....wtf?

You dont live in Earthquake country....

 

 

All that "preshock" "Foreshock"shit does is numb you to the danger.

 

For my entire life, they have been saying California needs to get ready for the "big one"... And there have been some pretty decent quakes in my lifetime.... But not THAT one....

 

I have no doubt when the "big one" hits, I will be sitting at my desk, like an idiot, debating whether it warrants taking any action.... And by the time I decide it does, it will be too late.

 

Pretty much spot on, unfortunately

So I wonder what the economic ramifications are going to be because of this. Japan is the second-largest foreign holder of America's debt. If they are really hurt economically from this, will they be able to continue buying our debt?

 

who buys japans debt?

He has a point.

 

as he says it is safe, ask him to go there and stop what is happening...

 

There are NO safe Nuclear Power plants, even the not pressurized BWR, but it's true that theyhave a very different threat level and they are very well built in order to reduce their effects in case of damage.

 

Also the Vajont dam was very well built (and it is stille there, with just minor damage), but killed 2000+ people: you can not lower the risk of a nuclear power plant so much to have a very low risk plant expecially if it is built over an earthquake area and near an ocean.

 

There have been many nuclear disaster, this Fukushima is just one, there will be others in the future, sure.

 

ciao

Good luck Japan, things are not looking too good.

"Contrary to what happened so far, there is no doubt that existing levels can damage your health: We recorded a high of 30 millisieverts between two three reactors, the reactor 400 mSv and 100 mSv three to four reactor, "he said The spokesman for the government, Yukio Edan.

 

Today.

I was just reading about a earthquake that struck Sendai in a similar manner in 869 A.D

This was pretty crazy to read. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/869_Sanriku_e...ake_and_tsunami

 

"Three tsunami deposits have been identified within the Holocene sequence of the Sendai plain, all formed within the last 3,000 years, suggesting an 800 to 1,100 year recurrence interval for large tsunamigenic earthquakes. In 2001 it was reckoned that there was a high likelihood of a large tsunami hitting the Sendai plain as more than 1,100 years had then elapsed.[4] As for the other two large tsunamis recognized before the 869 tsunami, one was estimated to have occurred between about 1000 BC and 500 BC and the other about 500 BC and 1 AD.[5] In 2007 the probability of an earthquake with a magnitude of Mw8.1–8.3 was estimated as 99% within the following 30 years"

So a scram'd reactor still outputs plenty of heat energy right?

 

Correct. Hence the need for intense cooling. All you have done is killed the reaction in an extremely fast manner.

Italian news:

 

12.55 HOURS, FRANCE: "FUKUSHIMA NUCLEAR POWER PLANT REACTOR IS NO MORE SEALED" - The structure to contain the number 2 reactor of the nuclear power plant in Fukushima in Japan IS "no longer watertight". Told reporters the president of the French Nuclear Safety (Asn), André-Claude Lacoste.

 

12.40 HOURS, FRANCE: "FUKUSHIMA ACCIDENT IS A LEVEL 6 on a scale from 0 to 7" - The nuclear accident in Fukushima is rated six of seven on an international scale: the president said the French Nuclear Safety Authority (ASN ), André-Claude Lacoste.

 

 

current time: 13:46

I was just reading about a earthquake that struck Sendai in a similar manner in 869 A.D

This was pretty crazy to read. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/869_Sanriku_e...ake_and_tsunami

 

"Three tsunami deposits have been identified within the Holocene sequence of the Sendai plain, all formed within the last 3,000 years, suggesting an 800 to 1,100 year recurrence interval for large tsunamigenic earthquakes. In 2001 it was reckoned that there was a high likelihood of a large tsunami hitting the Sendai plain as more than 1,100 years had then elapsed.[4] As for the other two large tsunamis recognized before the 869 tsunami, one was estimated to have occurred between about 1000 BC and 500 BC and the other about 500 BC and 1 AD.[5] In 2007 the probability of an earthquake with a magnitude of Mw8.1–8.3 was estimated as 99% within the following 30 years"

 

 

really a very good place where to build a Nuclear Power Plant, isn't it?

SF will be devastated...

 

Not all of it.

 

Chinatown will get hit hard, and perhaps some of the Marina too like it did in'89. The new cable stayed portion of the bay bridge will hold up better than the truss did last time.

 

SF shouldn't be worse off than the rest of California.

There are two "big ones" coming to California.

 

One on the northern San Andreas At the Devils slide/ Pacifica area/ San Andreas Lake. That will seriously damage everything built before 1971 that hasnt been seismically retrofitted in the city of San Francisco.

 

 

The other one, which is the REAL big one is LONG LONG overdo, and its where the fault swings inland in southern california... San Bernardino and Riverside.... Places like Victorville and Palm Springs are going to get hammered. And older homes in L.A. may get damaged.

Evacuation order at Fukushima Power Plant Control Room

 

13:39 The agency Kyodo reported that the radiation in the control room of the plant in Fukushima are too high, TEPCO experts have to leave the control room.

 

14:45 New quake of magnitude 6.2 in Japan.

 

 

current time 15:08

Two survivors in Japan reunited by rescuer.

 

This video deserves to be in the DAYM thread as much as it does in this thread. That's just plain freaky!

 

This video deserves to be in the DAYM thread as much as it does in this thread. That's just plain freaky!

 

 

 

There is a room full of lesbian geologists at caltech who would love to see that video.