So I know we're not supposed to talk politics - Presidential Election - Poll

and here we go it started already, those who opposed him prior election are crying like unruly teenagers at every single one of his moves after, nothing is good nothing is pleasing them, the banter prior the election was kind of entertaining the bitterness after is ugly and depressing.

 

I don't care who's the leader you have to be smart enough to realize that he or she needs TIME to do certain things, people can't magically pull rainbows out of their asses, it takes time, it's a process which has to take place, cry about them later, give the guy a chance, he's taking on something which needs fixing, things won't happen overnight.

 

What happened with the reasonable people who pull their sleeves up and go to work for the better of everyone? It's much harder to pull the cart forward if half the people who are supposed to help are dragging it backwards.

 

I think this thread should be put to death otherwise the complaining will be constant, relentless and annoying.

 

The political Left in particular were just like this with Obama too. One thing I have noticed about the Left that I do not know if it happens as much on the Right is that the Left tend to have individual groups with their pet causes that they care about at the expense of everything else. For example, the LGBTQ groups where their only concern is LGBTQ issues, not anything like economic policy, foreign policy, etc...then the Hispanic/Latino/immigrant groups where they only care about that, then the environmental groups that only care about the environmental issues, and so forth.

 

So Obama is elected and what do they do? The immigrant groups complain that he isn't moving fast enough on immigration reform, the LGBTQ groups lambast him for not moving fast enough on that, the environmental groups want him to move fast on environmental issues, etc...and I'm thinking, "GEEZ, the guy is trying to get healthcare done first, and has had the Republicans in Congress trying to block his every move, and you guys are complaining about all that stuff!?" Not that I wanted him to succeed in those things, but just that was my impression with the Left.

So Trump made (or received according to him) a call to Taiwan and and the Left are crapping their pants, saying it is playing with matches and he is provoking China and so forth. To this, I have a multitude of responses, and wondering people's thoughts:

 

1) Playing with matches? Provoking? How so? What exactly is China going to do? Stop buying our debt if we recognize Taiwan? We already do things much more offense such as maintain a commitment to defend Taiwan and sell them weapons. And why is it always viewed that we the United States must tip-toe and walk on eggshells with countries like China? CHINA is the one who has long now been provoking the United States with their increasing belligerence and aggression. The U.S. talking to Taiwan and maybe even establishing formal diplomatic relations with them is a reaction to the Chinese provocation.

 

2) In my opinion, the Left seem to view the leaders of these countries as being stupid. It is in my opinion part of the Left's elitism and belief in their own intelligence. They assume that the leaders of the Soviet Union or now China are stupid and childish and that you must thus walk on eggshells with them because if you so much as offend them, they will act crazy and WWIII will start. Only they themselves, the Left, are the ones who are intelligent and rational-thinking. Hence their horror when Ronald Reagan called the Soviet Union an Evil Empire.

 

Someone like Reagan or now Trump treats them like actual adults, which is what they are, where if you stand up to them or say some controversial things to them, they are not going to respond like idiots. They are rational, critical-thinking people. They engage in aggression when they perceive that it works and that they can get away with it. If anything, the walking on eggshells approach, IMO, is what leads to aggression, not prevents it.

 

3) The Left are saying, "He is going against what has been U.S. policy for forty years now!" Yeah, so? If it's wrong policy, then it needs to be changed. The policy of not recognizing Taiwan as a free nation was put into place by either Jimmy Carter, not exactly known for great foreign policy (it was Nixon who formally established relations with China to counter the Soviets, but I believe Carter was who ended the U.S.'s recognizing of Taiwan as a nation).

 

Personally I hope Trump acknowledges formally Taiwan as a free nation-state and not any renegade province that belongs to China, that he moves the U.S. embassy in Israel from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem, and that he tears up the Iranian deal (I do not buy that such a thing would be dangerous because I do not believe the Iranians would have ever signed up to the deal in the first place if it really prevented them from acquiring a nuclear weapon; they get to inspect their own facilities for Pete's sake).

The political Left in particular were just like this with Obama too. One thing I have noticed about the Left that I do not know if it happens as much on the Right is that the Left tend to have individual groups with their pet causes that they care about at the expense of everything else. For example, the LGBTQ groups where their only concern is LGBTQ issues, not anything like economic policy, foreign policy, etc...then the Hispanic/Latino/immigrant groups where they only care about that, then the environmental groups that only care about the environmental issues, and so forth.

 

So Obama is elected and what do they do? The immigrant groups complain that he isn't moving fast enough on immigration reform, the LGBTQ groups lambast him for not moving fast enough on that, the environmental groups want him to move fast on environmental issues, etc...and I'm thinking, "GEEZ, the guy is trying to get healthcare done first, and has had the Republicans in Congress trying to block his every move, and you guys are complaining about all that stuff!?" Not that I wanted him to succeed in those things, but just that was my impression with the Left.

 

Exactly my point whiners gonna whine the rest make it work the group you belong to is entirely your choice.

 

 

 

 

Not. Even. In. Office. Yet.

$50B, 50,000 jobs

https://www.google.com/amp/www.cnbc.com/amp...l?client=safari

A year from now lets look back on this, see how much he did(or didn't) accomplish and compare it to past presidents and politicians. If i'm a betting man, he makes the last 20years worth of elected officials of every rank look absolutely pathetic and lazy.

 

His drive and work ethic is undeniable.

Not. Even. In. Office. Yet.

$50B, 50,000 jobs

https://www.google.com/amp/www.cnbc.com/amp...l?client=safari

 

Awesome!

 

A year from now lets look back on this, see how much he did(or didn't) accomplish and compare it to past presidents and politicians. If i'm a betting man, he makes the last 20years worth of elected officials of every rank look absolutely pathetic and lazy.

 

His drive and work ethic is undeniable.

 

Really hope so. The country has been on the decline for a while.

Any capitalist country needs to be run like a big business by a ballsy business man not a bunch of softcocks.

Exactly my point whiners gonna whine the rest make it work the group you belong to is entirely your choice.

 

 

Any capitalist country needs to be run like a big business by a ballsy business man not a bunch of softcocks.

 

:iamwithstupid:

We have a lot of business people on this forum.... Does anybody else see what hes doing? Please... Tell me you do....

A year from now lets look back on this, see how much he did(or didn't) accomplish and compare it to past presidents and politicians. If i'm a betting man, he makes the last 20years worth of elected officials of every rank look absolutely pathetic and lazy.

 

His drive and work ethic is undeniable.

 

 

We have a lot of business people on this forum.... Does anybody else see what hes doing? Please... Tell me you do....

 

What is he doing you are referring to?

He is making a speech right now, talking about repealing and replacing Obamacare and also asking Congress to pass affordable and quality universal childcare. That must be with nudging from Ivanka, but I don't know how they expect to do it, because Canada tried it and it was a failure. I am no expert, but I think the problem there is that one can't have childcare that is both affordable and universal. Childcare doesn't strike me as something that can be commoditized. It requires high-quality people, and those cost money. So it can be inexpensive and lousy or expensive but high-quality.

 

But otherwise, liking most of what else he is saying. In many ways, Trump sounds like an old-fashioned Democrat: national security, protect American workers from unfair trade deals, infrastructure, stop illegal immigration, etc...

We have a lot of business people on this forum.... Does anybody else see what hes doing? Please... Tell me you do....

 

Looks to me he's playing a few different cards. One he's demonstrating that he will not be swayed to appease anyone at the cost of the USA, which should bolster Americas image and negotiating power. Also he's creating an image of investor confidence, as more industry comes back, investments in US grow from allies. Its basically the opposite of what Canada is doing. We are increasing taxes at a time when our number one product is at a low price, and entertaining every Tom Dick and Harry with their BS issues involving climate and pipelines. Like Wheels said, all these imbeciles have one agenda and bang that drum. The government shouldn't give them a platform and it would end.

We have a lot of business people on this forum.... Does anybody else see what hes doing? Please... Tell me you do....

 

IMO, this is laying the groundwork for a negotiation strategy with China.

 

What are you seeing?

Not. Even. In. Office. Yet.

$50B, 50,000 jobs

https://www.google.com/amp/www.cnbc.com/amp...l?client=safari

 

 

 

:lol2::lol2::lol2:

 

 

 

Never mind the fact that the money was coming here anyway, its going to go to tech (what happened to all the blue collar heartland spiel?) and the softbank guy just MIGHT have a vested interest in currying some favor because he is looking to merge Sprint (40k jobs) and T-mobile (36k jobs)???????????? Wonder how many redundancies occur when those two merge? A merger, by the way, that the obama administration has previously blocked?

 

 

Wake up. This is embarrassing.

 

 

Oh, and the carrier deal?

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp...m=.baa37d1ccb5d

 

 

The Taiwan phone call? $140k to Bob Doles bank account thank you very much. But omg waaaaaaah pay to play and stuff!

 

 

 

Delusions abounding. The thing about reality, though, is it usually seeps through eventually.

Goddamn I love DJT!!!!! Not even in office yet and he has done more to change the temperament of this country.

GO DONNIE....GO DONNIE!!!!!!

 

This is interesting. In recent years under the radar has been forced on many people. Now Trump is saying the opposite.

^ that really gets under my skin, pretending you are broke, I know people here who do that, they daily a crap box go around telling people they can't afford things but their garage at home is full of exotics and spend money like it's going out of fashion, what a terrible dishonest way to be.

 

 

https://www.google.com/amp/www.cnbc.com/amp...l?client=safari

I see it also. I manufacture and sell CNC machine tool accessories and November was my best month in history. Scrap steel is going up, raw finished steel is starting to creep up. I am trying to lock in and place a few blanket orders for steel before the increases.

IMO, this is laying the groundwork for a negotiation strategy with China.

 

What are you seeing?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hes renegotiating EVERYTHING!!!

 

 

"Air Force 1 5.0 is $4 billion! too expensive! Cancel the deal! "

 

 

 

Watch them deliver that fucker for a third of that....

 

 

 

 

We might ACTUALLY have elected a guy who gives a shit about how much the government is spending, instead of a "fuckit... Its not my money" guy that every other politician for the last 200 years has been...

 

And NOT because hes some altruistic saint... But because he treats it all as a game... Every election... Every bill... Every deal... HE fcuking WANTS TO WIN!!! Its a point of pride... And then when the game is done he says "good job!" shakes the opponents hand and looks for the next joust...

 

And winning to him is getting the most return for the least money.

 

 

 

"carrier is moving from indiana... It will cost 2000 jobs and 6 billion in lost revenue"

 

"We'll give you 7 million to stay here if you use it to improve your facility (money gets spent here) and we get to keep the jobs here and $5.994 billion in revenue. I win! Who's next?"

6 billion?

 

You mean 65 million a year right?

 

I suppose you could call it six billion if youre on a 100 year timeline?

 

 

Meanwhile the president elect is now fighting on twitter with the union boss who called him out on bullshitting the total number of jobs saved.

 

 

Cmon roman, not YOU. Youre smart. I mean, thats the biggest misrep on the numbers that ive seen yet

Meanwhile the president elect is now fighting on twitter with the union boss who called him out on bullshitting the total number of jobs saved.

 

 

And exactly how many Carrier jobs did the current president or his former Secretary of State try/manage to save ?

 

It is a union bosses job to piss and moan and fight for "his people". I get that. He should always want more for them. However, it must absolutely kill him that a right wing private citizen has saved more of his people's jobs than a left of centre government saved in two terms.

 

As a Canadian, I watch the US political scene with increasing interest. I do so because of the possible ramifications for our country.

 

I too am fearful of Trump..... for an entirely different reason .

 

I think that with his business savvy, he is going to absolutely turn our prime minister inside out if he is able to renegotiate sections of NAFTA.

 

I hope that president elect Trump will prove to be a true hybrid president. I hope that he is extremely strong on fiscal responsibility and is able to still move your country forward on important social issues.

 

 

 

6 billion?

 

You mean 65 million a year right?

 

I suppose you could call it six billion if youre on a 100 year timeline?

 

 

Meanwhile the president elect is now fighting on twitter with the union boss who called him out on bullshitting the total number of jobs saved.

 

 

Cmon roman, not YOU. Youre smart. I mean, thats the biggest misrep on the numbers that ive seen yet

 

Carrier is a $12.5 billion dollar company.....Not sure how much of that is affected by a move to mexico, or anywhere else for that matter.

 

We get it, you hate trump, you're bitter about him, and somehow any of his successes are a direct competition against you, who has somehow managed to do more with what you have then Trump ever could have dreamed of. But can we please, just stop trying to nit pick little nuances (like crying about only SOME of the jobs staying, and not all).

6 billion?

 

You mean 65 million a year right?

 

I suppose you could call it six billion if youre on a 100 year timeline?

 

 

Meanwhile the president elect is now fighting on twitter with the union boss who called him out on bullshitting the total number of jobs saved.

 

 

Cmon roman, not YOU. Youre smart. I mean, thats the biggest misrep on the numbers that ive seen yet

 

 

No. I said it right. The loss of carrier would have resulted in a 6 billion dollar loss to Indiana. Remember. I live here. You don't just lose those jobs. And the income tax carrier pays. You lose the income tax those employees pay. And the unemployment benefits we have to pay them. Carrier is an "anchor" employer. Those jobs create other jobs. Like the diner who feeds them lunch. The shops where they shop. The dr where they get their medical treatment. Etc. etc. etc. If Carrier leaves, they ALL get FUCKED.

 

People in the cities don't understand how fcuking devastating losing an employer in rural America is. And. That's why the dems lost.

 

A company closes in LA. Big whoop. There are a million more. Out here if one closed, it's a tsunami. EVERYBODY feels the impact.