Was school worth it? Did you even go?

To explain why I started this. A friend was telling me today he was driving past a Tim Hortons (huge doughnut and coffee shop in Canada for those who dont know) in Edmonton Alberta and the reader board outside said "every person currently on staff has a post secondary education and our manager has an MBA, please let us know if you are hiring".

 

My question is. How many people went to college/university right after high school? And did you use most of what you learned in your current line of work, or did you end up doing something completely different? Was it a bitch getting a job in your feild after you gratuated? I realize the economy is not super right now, but surely someone with an MBA could get a job with a little bit of a brighter future than Tim Hortons.

To explain why I started this. A friend was telling me today he was driving past a Tim Hortons (huge doughnut and coffee shop in Canada for those who dont know) in Edmonton Alberta and the reader board outside said "every person currently on staff has a post secondary education and our manager has an MBA, please let us know if you are hiring".

 

My question is. How many people went to college/university right after high school? And did you use most of what you learned in your current line of work, or did you end up doing something completely different? Was it a bitch getting a job in your feild after you gratuated? I realize the economy is not super right now, but surely someone with an MBA could get a job with a little bit of a brighter future than Tim Hortons.

 

 

When I graduated I didn't go right to school. And it's tough without a degree, hell it's tough with a degree. When I was in limbo a Aeronautical Engineer, I kid you not, was working security at a Best Buy I worked at. And this was years ago! He told me he took it off his resume so he could get the job!

 

So the one thing I noticed about school is the network you build and the opportunities that you can get, don't be fooled it's not about the "formal" education you get. That's something you could get out of any book you buy at the store. BUT it is the people, connections, network and other things that make school worth it.

When I graduated I didn't go right to school. And it's tough without a degree, hell it's tough with a degree. When I was in limbo a Aeronautical Engineer, I kid you not, was working security at a Best Buy I worked at. And this was years ago! He told me he took it off his resume so he could get the job!

 

So the one thing I noticed about school is the network you build and the opportunities that you can get, don't be fooled it's not about the "formal" education you get. That's something you could get out of any book you buy at the store. BUT it is the people, connections, network and other things that make school worth it.

I couldn't agree more.

It doesnt matter if you went to Harvard or a community college you will largely get the same information and the only thing gained is connections.

 

In my case yes it was worth it.

Interesting Wall St. Journal article on this subject

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1218586887...in_commentaries

 

First bit:

 

Imagine that America had no system of post-secondary education, and you were a member of a task force assigned to create one from scratch. One of your colleagues submits this proposal:

 

First, we will set up a single goal to represent educational success, which will take four years to achieve no matter what is being taught. We will attach an economic reward to it that seldom has anything to do with what has been learned. We will urge large numbers of people who do not possess adequate ability to try to achieve the goal, wait until they have spent a lot of time and money, and then deny it to them. We will stigmatize everyone who doesn't meet the goal. We will call the goal a "BA."

 

You would conclude that your colleague was cruel, not to say insane. But that's the system we have in place.

 

Finding a better way should be easy. The BA acquired its current inflated status by accident. Advanced skills for people with brains really did get more valuable over the course of the 20th century, but the acquisition of those skills got conflated with the existing system of colleges, which had evolved the BA for completely different purposes.

 

Outside a handful of majors -- engineering and some of the sciences -- a bachelor's degree tells an employer nothing except that the applicant has a certain amount of intellectual ability and perseverance. Even a degree in a vocational major like business administration can mean anything from a solid base of knowledge to four years of barely remembered gut courses.

Interesting Wall St. Journal article on this subject

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1218586887...in_commentaries

 

First bit:

 

Very good article.

 

But what it does not address is that the current education system is a business, and a thriving one at that.

 

The fear of not being able to succeed without a "degree" is driving people into HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of dollars of debt. Granted that's how our system works and will probably work for the rest of my lifetime but. People need to remember education is a business.

When I graduated I didn't go right to school. And it's tough without a degree, hell it's tough with a degree. When I was in limbo a Aeronautical Engineer, I kid you not, was working security at a Best Buy I worked at. And this was years ago! He told me he took it off his resume so he could get the job!

 

So the one thing I noticed about school is the network you build and the opportunities that you can get, don't be fooled it's not about the "formal" education you get. That's something you could get out of any book you buy at the store. BUT it is the people, connections, network and other things that make school worth it.

Wow thats nuts. Although. I can totally belive it. It's stories like that that can be so discouraging to kids after high school. Especially ones that aren't sure what they wanna do. That and the money you spend on going to school to get a degree. I've known a few people that go to school, spend thousands on a degree, finish it or get half way through and end up hating it and wanting to do something different.

Very good article.

 

But what it does not address is that the current education system is a business, and a thriving one at that.

 

The fear of not being able to succeed without a "degree" is driving people into HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of dollars of debt. Granted that's how our system works and will probably work for the rest of my lifetime but. People need to remember education is a business.

 

VERY true

Wow thats nuts. Although. I can totally belive it. It's stories like that that can be so discouraging to kids after high school. Especially ones that aren't sure what they wanna do. That and the money you spend on going to school to get a degree. I've known a few people that go to school, spend thousands on a degree, finish it or get half way through and end up hating it and wanting to do something different.

 

The problem is with the undue pressure of sending kids packing for a four year school the day they graduate high school. They need to be in the real world before they pursue a life long career, because most college graduates have no idea how the real world works and get a generally rude and abrupt awakening. Unless mom and dad with a trust fund are bank rolling them.

 

Was I jealous when I went back to school and all my friends had degrees and were starting jobs? Sure, absolutely. But quickly I was getting reports of how much they hated their jobs and wanted to do something else and are considering going back. Even a close personal friend went straight to college from high school, is making good money, has a house, car, etc. and he hates it. He hasn't been there even 3 years.

 

At that moment I really realized, while I didn't go the traditional route of education some here know my story, I am thrilled to have gone back later, truly knowing what I wanted to pursue, and makes it so much easier dealing with the general bullshit of college.

 

Being able to sit through general education classes you hate, because you realize you have to pay your dues, and you are moving toward the direction of your goal(s) is priceless.

I did the whole high school to college to graduate school track with no breaks. College taught me book stuff, and graduate school enhanced my 'thinking outside the box' abilities not to mention increasing my skill set. I have no connections from college, but I made MANY connections during graduate school.

 

Depending the field of study, you can get paid to go to graduate school. I got a PhD in chemistry and got paid via teaching general chemistry labs which is normal for most chemistry/physics graduate programs.

Went to college right after high school, 100% free ride, dropped out over halfway through. First 12 months out was very difficult socially because I worked non stop.

 

There are all kinds of opinions regarding school. I think it comes down to two things -- first, spend the time to figure out what you really want to do ( in general terms ) before you start, second, do the math on your debt.

 

None of my friends did either.

 

I did. I like art and business, so I double majored -- dropped the art on my second semester of freshman year. I did the math -- it was too easy not to.

 

The difference today between me and my friends is night and day. They get paychecks from their employers, I write paychecks to my employees (ok, actually payroll does.)

 

The lesson is if you can be bothered to think things through, your future is going to be a lot more promising. Don't be a loser.

 

By the way, I was still in school when I joined lambopower (2005.) I did the math and buying a lambo didn't really seem possible with the amount of money I would make after graduating, so I dropped out.

One thing I have heard that a lot of young people do not realize is that when pursuing college education, only go to a super-expensive top-of-the-line school if it is truly required for the field you are pursuing. For example, a top engineering school may cost a bundle, but it will have the facilities and professors and so forth to provide you with a top engineering education.

 

But if you are majoring in say mathematics, well technically you could probably spend the first two years at a community college, then the last two at any regular college or university and get the same level of education as a person attending a very expensive school. They say a lot of the professors that teach at community colleges eventually move onto the big schools.

 

Also make sure that if you need to attend an expensive school for your education, that the field you're heading into pays well. Don't pursue a lousy-paying field while running up a huge debt.

While I didn't follow that career path (electrical engineering,) I do value the experience and what I gained other than facts and knowledge of science.

There are all kinds of opinions regarding school. I think it comes down to two things -- first, spend the time to figure out what you really want to do ( in general terms ) before you start, second, do the math on your debt.

 

 

Could not have said it better. Figure out what you want to do with your life. People are afraid of taking a year or two off after HS before college, but I wish I could have done it to get to know myself a bit better. Picking your major is a major problem for a lot of kids since they do not know what they want to do - this created over medicated borderline suicidal employees down the line. Full disclosure - I have no idea what I am doing with my life either, but I'm working on it.

I didnt go to school. Also didnt go anywhere in life ether

 

on a side note. Just imagine how bitter the people are working there. Not sure if the sign is a good hiring tool.

One thing I have heard that a lot of young people do not realize is that when pursuing college education, only go to a super-expensive top-of-the-line school if it is truly required for the field you are pursuing. For example, a top engineering school may cost a bundle, but it will have the facilities and professors and so forth to provide you with a top engineering education.

 

But if you are majoring in say mathematics, well technically you could probably spend the first two years at a community college, then the last two at any regular college or university and get the same level of education as a person attending a very expensive school. They say a lot of the professors that teach at community colleges eventually move onto the big schools.

 

Also make sure that if you need to attend an expensive school for you education, that the field you're heading into pays well. Don't pursue a lousy-paying field while running up a huge debt.

 

It's not the education you get at Harvard, MIT, etc. It is the people you meet at these schools, You can meet members of the Kennedy, Bush, Reagan, Vanderbilt, Roosevelt etc families and that is where the cost of admission pays. Just like anything in life it is who you know, not necessarily what you know.

I went to highschool and did two semesters of college and then dropped out. I was making more money a month out of highschool than many of my college professors were making a year. I am doing very well and havnt looked back. I think schooling is beneficial to some people. but if you know what you are going to do, and how to do it I dont see the point. That is just me though.

I "waited a year" after high school. I had started a video production company with two other partners during my junior year of high school and was having fun/making money producing marketing videos. After that year, I went to (and quickly dropped out of) college after just a single quarter.

 

My business partner (same age as me) never started school at all. He was too busy running for, and being elected to, our local city council at age 19. Between our video company, another new start-up, his political office, Columbus Cars and Coffee, and writing for two magazines, I have never looked back. I'm learning as much (more!) in the "real world" than ANY of my peers are in classrooms. It all comes down to this - do you want to be hired by someone? I never want to be. For me, it was a qualification for something I don't want, to be "employed." It is the riskier path to be sure but for me the choice was obvious.

 

My biz partner and I in the middle of writing a book about this very topic.

School, like anything else, is only what you make of it. You get out of it what you put into it. If you just go to class, get decent grades, and don't know anybody when you graduate, then you just have a piece of paper and are pretty much at the bottom of the pile of resumes.

School, like anything else, is only what you make of it. You get out of it what you put into it. If you just go to class, get decent grades, and don't know anybody when you graduate, then you just have a piece of paper and are pretty much at the bottom of the pile of resumes.

 

Usually a good school will have you do a co-op to help with this, so that by the time you graduate, you have a reputation and relationships with various employers.

 

 

For me, school did nothing but credential me....

 

I struggled with school from a young age and really couldn't wait to be done with it (that probably sounds strange coming from a guy who went to school for 22 years and has several advanced degrees-)....

 

But as a child I had a mild case of Dyslexia, although when I was a kid, it didnt really have a name.... At least the teachers I had had never heard of it.... So I was labeled every derogatory term one can think of.... I mean, I didnt really learn to read until I was in fourth grade..... So I guess I learned "Differently" than other people and had to develop my own set of skills to teach myself what I wanted to know, because I quickly learned teachers couldn't, or wouldn't.... Some of them (especially two or three early elementary school teachers, who if I met them today I would probably need to be physically restrained to keep me from hurting them) treated me very badly...

 

But once I did learn to read, I quickly eclipsed my classmates in standardized tests of reading ability, vocabulary and reading comprehension (I was in the top 1% of college graduates in those areas by the time I was in 6th grade.)

 

So for me, School became a sort of "fcuk you" to those teachers I felt wronged by..... I taught MYSELF what I needed to know, and the teachers became nothing but a credentialing service, signing off on the fact that I had learned it satisfactorily.....

 

And that was the attitude I had throughout school....

 

There are some jobs (like mine) that REQUIRE a credentialed education.... And obviously, if thats what you want to pursue, you have to jump through the hoops..... But if thats not what you want to do, I would just teach yourself what you need to know, and DO IT.

 

 

As far as the "networking" thing.... Uh.... I've not experienced that in the least.... I got where I got on my own, not because I knew somebody who helped me.....

I hated school too. I do love learning and education though. So many subjects fascinate me.

I see it all too often, and on here right now, that people are equating further education with prospects of wealth. Why? You can learn a hell of a lot more in school than you can outside of it, at least when it comes to some academic paths. If you just want to make money, it can go either way, but if you want to become a doctor, or a chemist, or want to learn purely out of interest, college and further education are the real paths to it. It's not impossible to do it without, but you have a much better chance with it. The guys who built the LHC aren't self-taught...

http://www.forbes.com/2000/06/29/feat.html

 

had this saved in my favorites, worth the read to anyone looking for a better answer if school is really "worth" it

http://www.forbes.com/2000/06/29/feat.html

 

had this saved in my favorites, worth the read to anyone looking for a better answer if school is really "worth" it

 

Look at average college graduate income vs. average non-graduate income for the entire US population. For every rich guy who didn't go to college, there are probably 1000 others who make less than $40k a year.

 

If you have a good idea, wealth will follow regardless of if you went to school. If you don't have a good idea, well then you'd have to be a fool to argue against a degree.

 

Beside, education should be a quest for knowledge, not wealth.

No college here. School is needed for some people - teachers, doctors, lawyers etc or others wanting a "secure" future, but if your main objective is to work for yourself, then school is a waste of time and money. College = Massive debts, x-years with little to no income and time that you could be spending on improving a product or doing research on a business idea.

 

Also the real world and college are 2 different things. You can learn a TON by starting small businesses with very limited funds. The possibilities are endless. Small local businesses to world wide (via the internet).

 

I have always hated school (besides the social aspect of it). If I want to learn something about x-subject I will pick up a book on the subject.

 

Now with the Internet the "connections" you get can be made from any forum on the Internet. That point is not that valid any more.