Big Indy car crash at Vegas

I knew it was going to be bad for him when they put a tarp over his car after they removed him. It usually means they are preserving the content for some investigation. None of the other cars were covered. Graham was having a good run, I was really hoping for a win for him.

 

 

I watched it this afternoon on tape delay, when I saw the tarp and Tracy's interview I knew he was done. It's such a shame. Involved in an accident he didn't cause. They had 34 cars out there, with the pay to play, many of the back markers are just boys coddled by dada's big paycheck. It's shit.

 

I used to want my son to race, no more.

Real shame, he was one of the good guys. RIP.

 

 

Yes he was. He commentated a couple of the races and was very good. He was a great driver. RIP Danny Wheldon..

Someone on another forum I read said that his head was pulled off by the catch fence. Horrific. Worst for his two young kids and wife

 

 

Fuuuuuuck. Thats the worst crash Ive ever seen.

 

Did he leave the track all together? Where did the car end up?

 

 

After the picture were the car is airborn, it kept travelling and collided in air against the crash barrier and fence.

 

As per highonpsi's post, I also heard that the fence caused perhaps a decapitation, or at the very least severe head trauma. The race official said when they cancelled the race that it was an unsurvivable injury.

 

 

Sad.

 

 

 

http://twitpic.com/71fy8z/full

 

RIP

What a brutal crash. Horrific if decapitation was involved. RIP

I've hung out with Dan. Great Guy. I was shocked. RIP.

RIP.

 

Sad,why the Formula cars doing laps at what seems to me is a nascar track?

 

 

RIP.

 

Sad,why the Formula cars doing laps at what seems to me is a nascar track?

 

I couldn't figure that out either. In interviews many of the drivers were concerned about the high banking and speeds, small track and large number of cars with no room to pass. Seems their concerns were well founded. RIP Dan.

Don't think there was any decapitation, at least not in the literal sense of the word. The pics still show his helmet protruding from the cockpit after the car came back down on the track, and there is also a pic of them rushing him to a helicopter on a gurney in which he appears to be in one piece. I don't think they would have airlifted him at all if he was literally decapitated, but that doesn't mean the injuries weren't horrific all the same.

Don't think there was any decapitation,

 

 

 

I agree, I had heard that on a radio show but didn't believe it was the case for the reasons you mentioned.

 

Severe head trauma is more likely.

 

 

 

 

RIP.

 

Sad,why the Formula cars doing laps at what seems to me is a nascar track?

 

This is Indy Car racing about half the races take place on an oval course, the other half on a road course

I dont want to make light of what happened, but this is an inherently dangerous sport, flying around a track at 200+mph. This is bound to happen over and over again.

 

these guys know the risks.

Don't think there was any decapitation, at least not in the literal sense of the word. The pics still show his helmet protruding from the cockpit after the car came back down on the track, and there is also a pic of them rushing him to a helicopter on a gurney in which he appears to be in one piece. I don't think they would have airlifted him at all if he was literally decapitated, but that doesn't mean the injuries weren't horrific all the same.

 

Not that I have any more information here than anyone else, but with the roll hoop ripped off the car, I'm sure his head/neck saw some massive trauma. He very well may have internally severed his brain stem or carotid artery internally and essentially bled to death internally.

 

At any rate it is a very sad and tragic accident, but an accident none the less.

 

 

 

RIP Dan W. respects to friends and family.

 

 

races like those are asking for trouble. over 200mph, 3 wide on a small oval.

 

 

when open wheel race cars touch, usually one is going airborne. when a slower open wheel race car is hit from behind by a car traveling MUCH faster, the overtaking car is going to fly... FAR.

 

i wonder in Dan W and others whose cars went airborne weren't paying attention (to slow down) or because of the high rate of closing speed and ever changing situation, couldn't change course in time..

 

more people could have been killed..

 

it looked bad and it was. what a shame.

 

 

 

RIP.

 

I know all drivers understand the inherant risks, but it is still very sad when it happens.

I can see right from the cause of the accident, all the cars that braked understeered towards inside of the track,probably due to the banking angle. What seems to me is the cars are doing so fast, no one seems to have enough time to brake, or didn't see the accident in the front. Dan surely had enough time to brake, if he had seen the first accident. but maybe These Cars have very little Air resistance, due to the set up for This High Speed Track!

 

Also, What's the Cockpit safty like in indy cars compare to Formula 1

Cockpit safety is actually quite good in these cars. Indy Cars are heavier and more robust than F1 cars to be able to withstand higher speed crashes resulting from driving on ovals. However, the nature of this particular accident was such that it was not survivable. Whatever force that was enough to rip the roll bar off the car was obviously enough to inflict blunt force trauma to take the life of Dan Wheldon. As in many crashes, luck plays a huge role. Had his car been angled differently the outcome may have been different.

 

Very sad.

Was reading an article last night that him and his wife had just gotten each others initials tattooed on their wrists only a few hours before the race. Said that his wife and family were by his bedside when he passed

Any facts released yet in the cause of death? Who caused the initial accident?

 

Although it has been a few years since the last death in this type of racing, it is clearly a blood sport. The cars may well be heavier than a f1 car but that means a heavier lump hitting the other car.

I can see right from the cause of the accident, all the cars that braked understeered towards inside of the track,probably due to the banking angle. What seems to me is the cars are doing so fast, no one seems to have enough time to brake, or didn't see the accident in the front. Dan surely had enough time to brake, if he had seen the first accident. but maybe These Cars have very little Air resistance, due to the set up for This High Speed Track!

 

Also, What's the Cockpit safty like in indy cars compare to Formula 1

 

 

they are taught not to brake.

My business partner just returned home from the race. He is a friend of Sam Schmidt, Wheldon's team owner. http://espn.go.com/racing/indycar/story/_/...n-wheldon-death

 

He said the accident was horrific in person and that the makeshift memorial that the race turned into following incident was equally unsettling.

 

 

 

Open wheel on tight oval track... doesn't even sound like a good idea. RIP

 

 

I can see right from the cause of the accident, all the cars that braked understeered towards inside of the track,probably due to the banking angle. What seems to me is the cars are doing so fast, no one seems to have enough time to brake, or didn't see the accident in the front. Dan surely had enough time to brake, if he had seen the first accident. but maybe These Cars have very little Air resistance, due to the set up for This High Speed Track!

 

Also, What's the Cockpit safty like in indy cars compare to Formula 1

 

It would seem to me from all the recent improvements (and a roof) that even at the speed he was running that that crash in a Nascar Sprint Cup car might have been survivable.

 

 

 

It would seem to me from all the recent improvements (and a roof) that even at the speed he was running that that crash in a Nascar Sprint Cup car might have been survivable.

 

 

The Nascar COT (Car of tomorrow, those rednecks are imaginative) as they call it, is a lot safer. They increased the cockpit size, raised the roof, moved the driver more to the center and increased the structural reinforcement, plus they have completely redesigned the seats as well to protect the drivers. Having a roof and bulletproof windows helps too.

 

Keep in mind also that a NASCAR can't do 220mph, they have narrower tires, weigh twice as much, generate a lot less downforce and are bricks aerodynamically. They top out around 180 mph at that track. Crashing at 180 mph while it sucks, is a lot better than crashing at 220mph. The NASCAR's also have roof flaps they help prevent them taking off, though in the past few years there have been several cars thrown into the catch fences and some spectators have been seriously injured. One day a NASCAR will either go over or through a catch fence and there will be carnage. Mercedes didn't race for decades after one their SLR's crashed in '55. It crashed and basically exploded at Le Mans in a viewing section killing 80 plus people. Spectator safety at a lot of tracks is a real and often ignored issue. There is also less pay to play in NASCAR so the drivers generally have more experience. Also the lower tier Nationwide and ARCA series allow a lot more driver development in comparable cars. It's a much, much bigger step from Indy Lights to Indycar than from Nationwide to Cup.

 

The new Indycar car that Wheldon was helping develop was going to be introduced next year. It is supposed to be a lot safer, it will have body work between the axles and behind the rear wheels to reduce the chance of cars being launched when they interlock wheels. They also have improved impact protection etc. The old Dallara was an ancient design and has had a history putting drivers in hospital due to design flaws. They had an issue for years where if a driver went into a wall backwards they kept breaking backs and having spinal damage. The car hadn't been redesigned in years due to the financial woes of the series. Simona De Silvestro chassis was so old and been rebuilt so many times, the crew called it porkchop.

 

The problem they have is at the 1.5 mile NASCAR ovals the Indycar drivers can drive flat out all the time, it takes (comparatively) little skill to do it. So they are all bunched up together and due to the banking (which was increased at Vegas since they last ran there in 2000 or so) and the massive amounts of down force they generate, the cars can run 3 a breast if the track is wide enough literally inches apart. It's more crowded than rush hour on the 405. The NASCAR ovals generally have more banking to compensate for their lack of downforce and grip, making the problem worse for an Indycar. A couple of years ago at Texas, the CART drivers were pulling such high g forces they were experiencing dizzyness and the race was cancelled. They were lapping Texas at 235mph. A lot of the back markers are getting drives because of their bank balances or sponsorship deals and as a result, many of the drivers these days lack the skill, judgement and experience necessary to drive a track like Vegas. The guy that caused the crash has minimal oval experience in an Indycar, he has had three starts in Indycar total. There has been talk of reintroducing the Hanford device that CART used to use on ovals. It's basically a vertical strip that runs across the back of the rear spoiler to increase drag, which allows passing and therefore spreads out the cars on the track.

 

Personally I am surprised deaths don't occur more often. There have been multiple examples of these types of crashes where the drivers have been injured and you are sitting there thinking how the hell wasn't that guy killed. Will Power, another driver caught up in the accident also took off and flew even further than Wheldon, the only reason he is alive though injured is he went in backwards to the catch fence.

In Formula one they have introduced a discretionary 107% rule, would I be right in thinking that they do not adopt this in Cart to rid the slower drivers on race day?